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Author Topic: This is why you should use solid copper bullets  (Read 4610 times)

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Online deadeye

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Not too concerned about the ravens but a carcass really attracts the eagles.







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Online mike89

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a bad day of fishing is still better than a good day at work!!

Offline snow1

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Agreed cool pics for sure,looks like the entire family showed up,one would think said bullet would pass through like my arrows do.

Offline Onin24Eagle

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I guess I'll play devil's advocate here and toss in an unpopular opinion but I tried all copper bullets and I may never use them again.

In 2010, I reloaded a bunch of rounds for my .270 WSM with Barnes 140 grain all copper bullets that were supposed to expand into a "four leafed clover" upon impact.  The manufacturer's claim was that they were more devastating than lead and environmentally friendly.  So ok, I was sold.  I'll give them a try.  Tried them on the range and they were just as accurate and off I went opening day. 

It was the third or fourth day of the season when I had a really nice 8 point come out into the clearing about 110 yards out standing broadside.  I put the cross hairs on his vitals and pulled the trigger.  He lifted his head and just stood there.  I shot again.  He kind of half flinched and continued to just stand there.  I shot a third time and he took off running back the way he came from as if it was nobody's business.  I spent the next 20 minutes examining my scope, making sure it was tight and nothing was loose because based on what I witnessed I was pretty sure I didn't singe a single hair on that deer.  I decided I may as well go look and determined that if I did indeed miss I would have to hike back to the truck and retrieve my back up rifle from the back seat.  Found his tracks, looked everywhere.  No hair, no blood, nothing.  It was 100 yards or so from the wood line so I just kept walking towards the spot I saw him run back into the woods.  Still nothing.  Not a drop of blood.  After an hour or so of looking I determined to walk back to my truck and get said back up gun but I was already in the woods so I figured I'd take the atv trail rather than walk back out to the field.  50 yards more from where I left off looking, there he was.  At this point he had probably run 250 yards from where he was when I shot.  After field dressing I found the 3 entry holes all within 4 inches of each other and exit holes on the opposite side.  If I didn't know beforehand which way he was facing and which side I shot at, you would not have been able to tell the difference.  The bullets didn't expand at all.  3 pencil diameter holes on both sides, got both lungs with all 3 shots.

Until they make an all copper bullet that actually expands and I see it with my own eyes, I'm afraid I have to stick to my Remington Core Lokt bullets.  I take pride in placing a good shot and not having to track deer.  Don't get me wrong, I'm all for environmentally friendly ammo but I also don't like wounding deer and risking having them run off and not being found.
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Online Boar

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imba hornady fan myself never had to track a deer
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Online Leech~~

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Its interesting how you hear of people who have been shot and they could not remove the bullets. I know a hunting guide who still has lead shot in his face because they thought it to dangest to remove it all. How are these people not dying of lead poisoning?  :scratch:
Cooking over a open fire is all fun and games until someone losses a wiener!

Online deadeye

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Onim24Eagle,
Glad you had a good outcome but would have to think it had something to do with "In 2010, "I reloaded a bunch of rounds" and it was earlier in the solid copper push and there may as well been an issue with the bullets.  I saw all the x rays taken of shot deer as well as packaged meat and the bullet path was littered with lead fragments. It was enough to convince me.  I might add that we have not lost a single deer since switching to solid copper.  The first picture above clearly shows the exit hole from a 150gr solid copper Barns .270 that my grandson shot during the early season. The two below are of the blood trail we followed.  The moment I saw the blood I told him we will find a dead deer at the end of this trail.  Not sure how all the others think about lead verses solid copper so maybe here's a place to find out what peoples experiences have been.



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Online Steve-o

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Its interesting how you hear of people who have been shot and they could not remove the bullets. I know a hunting guide who still has lead shot in his face because they thought it to dangest to remove it all. How are these people not dying of lead poisoning?  :scratch:

Birds are really susceptible to lead poisoning. 

National Park Service:  Lead Bullet Risks for Wildlife & Humans


Radiograph of condor 318 with lead fragments in the digestive tract, with a pullout photo of the actual lead fragment removed from the bird. This bird died from lead poisoning in 2012.

Online Steve-o

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Not sure how all the others think about lead verses solid copper so maybe here's a place to find out what peoples experiences have been.

You make a good case, DE.  Right now, I'd be happy to find any bullets on the shelf for deer hunting.   :bonk:

Online Leech~~

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I have no problem at all using copper loads. I just don't like the bad or forced science, that says people are going to die of lead poisoning. When millions of people have eaten every kind of animal shot with lead bullet's since the first gun was made!  :coffee:
Cooking over a open fire is all fun and games until someone losses a wiener!

Offline dakids

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We switched to all copper.  Most drop in their tracks. 

Love gut pile pictures.
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Online glenn57

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I haven't had much issues either and my boxes say copper bullets.
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Online glenn57

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2015 deer slayer!!!!!!!!!!

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Offline Onin24Eagle

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You have a valid point deadeye, I guess the experience I had just left a bad taste in my mouth.  Like I said, I'd need to see it with my own eyes in order to be convinced.  There's a cafe in our local town that I haven't eaten at in almost 20 years because the last time I ate there I got food poisoning.  It's kind of like that for me.  The thought of only wounding a deer gives me a sick feeling in my stomach.  Maybe I'm the only one like that but that's how I am.  I want it dead where it was standing.  I don't like tracking deer. 
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Online deadeye

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Onin24Eagle,
I felt this way also that lead was the way to ensure a clean kill.  After reviewing all the information and seeing the x-rays, I knew I needed to at least give the solid copper a chance.  I do believe the bullets today are far different that they were 10 years ago.  I attached a few x-rays of deer shot with led bullets and they are scary.  Also, maybe you get a "clean" kill for the deer but the lead in the carcass and gut pile does not cause a "clean" kill for the animals that eat it.  Maybe it's time to try out the new copper bullets. 

 





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Online mike89

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a bad day of fishing is still better than a good day at work!!

Online Jerkbiat

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Quite interesting. Not sure I am buying it myself.
Hey look your bobber is up!

Online deadeye

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Here's a couple more x-rays of venison burger.  The bright spots are lead.  During the tests, lead was detected in 32% of all sampled burger that was professionally processed. I've seen enough research reports to be convinced not to use lead bullets.
The packages were sub-sampled and the researchers found that 32% of 234 ground venison packages contained at least one metal fragment and 93% of all fragments were positively identified as lead. Ground venison packages being x-rayed for presence of lead bullet fragments.

Burger packages - CT Scanner


Burger packages


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Online LPS

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Wow that really spread.  I shot a deer in the lungs with copper and the lungs were toast. 

Online Leech~~

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I've seen the splatter ex-rays before.
Interestingly, out of over may be 50 Deer I have eaten from in my life time that I and others have all shot with lead bullets.  I have never that I can remember even once bit into any lead fragments.
Shot in Ducks, Geese, Grouse, Pheasant, Rabbits yes, but not once lead in Deer meat.  :confused:
« Last Edit: November 11/03/20, 07:05:48 PM by Leech~~ »
Cooking over a open fire is all fun and games until someone losses a wiener!

Online LPS

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Same here Leech.  I sure don't like biting a steel shot in a bird.  That is hard stuff.

Online glenn57

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been there done that also!!!!!!!! :confused:
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Offline snow1

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bullet fragments in the body usually work they're way up to the surface skin,one will not get lead posing as I have lead shrapnel in my face for 50 years unless lead is injested like waterfowl picking up lead pellets from shallow sloughs or harvested fields,then said lead pellets louge in waterfowl's gizzard causing a slow death and often effects birds of pray like this pic,same with hunting dogs mistakingly shot during a hunting trip,my dog was shot one year,hind quater,several lead pellets,emergency vet settled me down told me the body builds a barrier around foriegn objects and there are 100's of birds dogs running around with lead bird shot in em

eating game birds not head shot,it took me four cracked teeth/root canals over 20 years for the light to come on "hand held metal detector",menards has stud finders that report metal screws  for your home repairs,they work great rather than probing for shot with your knife/finger.

FYI

Online Steve-o

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I found three old copper bullet threads in forums, so I decided to post up in the most recent.

I finally found some copper bullets, so I'm making the switch this year for deer.

I found some Hornady Superformance CX in 7mm-08 for my new hunting rifle at Joe's and picked up some Barnes Vor-TX TSX in .243 for my daughter.

If we husband our ammo and take careful aim, we both ought to be set for the next 40 years.  ;)  :fudd:

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At muzzleloader velocities my home cast conicals do nor fragment.