Dont Complain about Ducks...

[LandDr]

If you don't do something to help the ducks out...then I don't want to hear about any complaining next fall about "where are the ducks?"

Out of all the people and groups that I work with...duck hunters are the worst for doing anything for the critter they hunt.  I don't understand that as duck hunters are also some of the most passionate hunters there are.

Pheasant hunters probably do more for pheasants than any other group does for their favorite hunting species...large projects with grasslands, woody cover, food plots and feeders.  Deer hunters are probably the hardest working and most dedicated since they often have the worst conditions for putting in food plots and probably work the hardest at it.  Duck hunters...you don't have to chop any trees down, till the ground or spray anything or plant mass expanses of grassland and trees.

So what is the hold up in helping the ducks?

Got ya feeling bad now...well you should...but here are some ideas for your salvation...

1.  There are several programs available to pay for wetland restoration work.  USFW has a Partners For Wildlife Program that will actually do all of the work for FREE.  I would recommend this program on "non-crop" land.  If it is crop land that you are working with, then there are a host of programs that will actually create an annual income (often more than what you are getting now) and even bonus payments...and the cost share for doing the work is usually up to 90%...ALMOST FREE.  It is FREE when you consider the additional annual income and bonus payments as those payments will cover your remaining 10%.  Let me know if you need help figuring out what program to use on your property.

2.  Fatheads a problem on your pond...eating up all the good invertebrates that your ducks eat?  I have done this several times with great success...contact a local bait dealer/fish farmer and talk to them about putting walleye fingers in your pond.  Those hungry little walleyes will rapidly consume the fatheads and often results in an invertebrate explosion!  You can lease the pond to the fish guy or maybe you are happy to let him use it in trade for some better duck hunting.  Those walleyes will also eat up bullheads!  Also...make sure to get out on your pond during the winter for some possible walleye fishing BEFORE it winter kills.  I have caught many 10 to 12 inch walleyes on some of my ponds after a summer stalking...not big walleyes but if they are going to die anyway, might as well eat em up!

3.  Freshwater Shrimp...once your fatheads are gone or reduces or maybe you don't have any to start with...freshwater shrimp are an excellent option for your pond.  Ducks LOVE shrimp!  Ask any old timer.  We are harvesting shrimp during the month of February and will continue until the ice gets bad or we feel we need to stop harvesting from our ponds.

4.  Sago and Celery...another great waterfowl food source.  I have a 10 ac. Sago pond with shrimp that is fantastic for ducks!

5.  Wild rice...we all know ducks love wild rice.  We have been pretty successful at getting rice started in plain old ponds...no moving water or anyting...just a plain old pond.  We have some rice still on inventory but will harvest rice again in Sept.  Easy to take with you out to your duck pond...hunt ducks in the morning and throw rice out in the afternoon.

6. Flooded Fields...this is probably the most underused option in the midwest.  Flooding a crop field in the fall will definately draw the ducks in!  Just don't knock down, cut or shatter the crop so you are not baiting.  Directly from the USFW headquarters in Virginia that flooding crops IS NOT baiting.

For more information on these items, see the MNO Habitat Outlet Store...click on the right and go to Waterfowl Food Plots for more information on all of the options above.

http://www.habitatnow.com/go/mno

No complaining about the ducks

LandDr

[Bufflehead]

 I believe Minnesotan's are one of the largest donaters to DU & Delta. It's not Minnesota's waterfowlers fault that they take much of this money and spend it elsewhere. The DNR and our legislature have dropped the ball for way too many years. Raiding game and fish funding to build paved bike paths, bird watching platforms, study after study after study..with no action. Maybe you weren't standing on the capital lawn with 1000s of duck hunters asking our beloved elected to do something at the Duck Rally. I was. Myself, I say it's high time all the free loaders who's outdoor past time pays NOTHING into our state DNR and just continue to hang on the wallets of hunters, anglers, snowmobilers, atvers and such..START PAYING THEIR WAY!!!

 I think your being a little hard on the wrong people...we have payed our way and then some for far too long and had our money stolen for other pet projects unrelated to ducks or other waterfowl. Like the 1000s of miles of tile that have drained every slew from Wilmar to the Iowa and South Dakota boarder in the name of Corp farming They are to blame for much of the loss of our migrating ducks.

 Lots of problems for our waterfowl, far more than we can ever repair, all we can do is slow down the inevitable
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  Quote
"6. Flooded Fields...this is probably the most underused option in the midwest.  Flooding a crop field in the fall will definately draw the ducks in!  Just don't knock down, cut or shatter the crop so you are not baiting.  Directly from the USFW headquarters in Virginia that flooding crops IS NOT baiting."

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 I will say, your rolling the dice. the law says, anything that is not normal farming practice is baiting. Flooding standing crops with no intention of harvesting them..is baiting to most C.O's. Now, if you have lots of money to pay a lawyer to fight it in court...have at it but I'll play it safe and hunt where I know I'm legal

[fubar]

dont try to make us feel bad becasue your shrimp arent selling. i duck hunt in ND anyhow.

[kingfisher1]

dont try to make us feel bad becasue your shrimp arent selling. i duck hunt in ND anyhow.

  Wihle Shrimp do help ducks, I'm sure LandDr's intent is to get the word out on duck habitat.

[JCAMERON]

Genuine question; Do alot of ducks die because there isn't enough food? Are you talking about enticing ducks into your waters/ lands for refuge?

[kenhuntin]

Yes alot die because of malnourishment on their migrations. Not just from starvation but it affects their ability to evade predators, fight off disease, and ability to lay eggs when they reach the nesting grounds. Ducks do not have a Mcdonalds to stop in at lunchtime on their way to the prairie pothole region of North Dakota and Canada. Minnesota is no longer a breeding state because all the cheaply purchased swamp lands that were drained to turn into $ profits. Minnows are good to fish with but are devastating to puddle ducks. Even minnow dealers are responsible for loss of duck habitat by leasing farm ponds and stocking them with roe.
  We can save what we have left and restore some of what was lost . We could also turn North Dakota into the hands down top fathead minnow producer of the nation. It is your choice.

[PJ Maguire]

Yea, the good fishing in MN killed the duck hunting. Too bad. Personally I would take good hunting.

[JohnWester]

Yea, the good fishing in MN killed the duck hunting. Too bad. Personally I would take good hunting.

too true... 
fishermen to state: "fishing sucks, we want better fishing"
state to dnr: "the people say fishing sucks, raise more fish(walleyes) and stock the lakes"

dnr goes and raises walleyes in little ponds all over state, find out that the ones that contain fresh water shrimp work great... raise more fish.

hmm... no more shrimp in little lakes and ponds for ducks...  ducks go elsewhere.

note to dnr and state and everyone else...  dnr is not god.  if it was meant to have fish in it, they will reproduce and grow there...

[LandDr]

Finally!  Finally some discussion.   

I put a lot of posts on here about fishing updates, food plots, habitat...and this time about ducks...and I often feel like I am writing to myself.  Great to finally have some responses.

It always amazes me when someone criticizes me for selling products and services..."your shrimp are not selling"...just because I am a private guy.  I promise you that if you were to support private businesses in the habitat management business...your tax dollar would go a lot further than where your tax dollar currently goes to.  Have you seen what the top officers in your favorite organizations are getting paid?  Go to the Attorney General's web site and look it up.  You might be amazed at all of the 6 figure numbers on the balance sheet while the volunteers are working their tails off.  I would recommend more support for the private partners cause they are tax payers and in the trenches right beside you getting it done on the land.  I will assure you that my little company and all of the rest of the private companies in the state are getting a heck of a lot more done on the land.  We are results and performance driven.

I also was not referencing how much each group pays for licenses, taxes, etc...we all pay that.  I was more talking about what we can do with your duck hunting pond or lake.  I agree 100% with your comments and frustrations with where our money goes.  I just don't give them money any more...I do support MWA and Delta however.  There projects are more at home and they seem to be more motivated individuals that want to get things done.  Maybe we should all start a fund that we can all donate to where 100% of the money is used for projects?  Make it a tax write off?  And the projects are listed and highlighted to show accountability and performance and results.  We all want that.  What do you think of that?  Then we control where it goes.

I am happy to see some passion finally.  Please take that passion and now get involved with what is going on with the dedication funding that you voted for this past election, the Lessard Council and what is going on with that.  Read Dennis Anderson's articles and the comments that sportsman and voters are having on the abuse that is going on.  This is our tax payer money and they are potentially throwing it away.  If you want to see what I sent in as a proposal, I will post it for everyone to read and comment on.  I would like to hear what everyone thinks of it so I can also comment.

I will put it the "Habitat Forum".

Thanks again...appreciate the comments.

Kyle, PLM

[snow]

Kyle,I understand your point,however I have not only sponsored DU for 9 years but I have also represented Chevrolet at different DU Chapters around the cities,infact I (my company) just gave away the 2009 chevy silverado last saturday at the state convention.But,as some have stated I'm seeing the DU memberships dewindle,could be the lack money these days but the conversation's say different,"the money we raise goes to outof state projects" then to make things worse when we go to different states to hunt we are subjected to strick rules and a regulated time line to hunt in most other states or even the lottery like in SoDak,their WPA's are funded by our money.PF on the other hand,the money stays in our state for local and state projects and land purchases.

There is alot to be said about MN farm practices thats was stated here earlier,anyone that drives thru western MN into the Dakotas can see the distinct differnce in farm practices.You have brought up some good advice and things I was unawhere of about funding and other programs we can get involved with.

Thanks,

Tim

[Mayfly]

Pheasants forever works why doesn't ducks unlimited?? You mentioned that Pheasant hunters do some of the most for their game. Most of that is done through Pheasants forever. I'm not a duck hunter and not a member of DU but what are they doing??

[3willy]

MY 2 cents is that due to farming practices now days is one big reason we don't see the numbers. When I was a kid in the 70's we raised small grain beans and corn, it was about a 50/50 mix. You had plowed field that had green grass in them from either small grain seeds or wild crab grass but the ducks and geese had somthing to eat when they landed now we have very little small grain and a ton of soybeans and corn. And if the feild were not harvested yet there is nothing for them to eat. That is why the flight path has moved west to south dakota idstead of western mn like it used to be. With modern day chemicals and the drainage of a lot of the little pot hole we have lost a lot of good habitat. The over abundance of geese probobly doesn't help either. Farmers are going to do what is best for them to make some money and i don't blame them. But should we start some incentives for them to help out the habitat? maybe give them a tax break for there wetlands or get corporate americam to change the market so the would plant more small grain and atract the flight path back to mn. It is going to talk a lot of different people to get the ducks back to the way it was. Everyone has towork together stop blaming each other and work together to solve this problem. fixing one out of 10 things doesn't do that much good. That just my 2 cents. Sorry if I offended anyone.

[LandDr]

95% of all wildlife are born and raised on private lands.  I am a big believer in private lands and working on private lands.  There will never be enough public land to meet the need for public use or raise enough wildlife for public use.  It has to be done on private lands.

That said, I am not against organizations buying land to make it open to public land.  I wish it was managed better however as I personally feel that much of the public lands have a "low carrying capacity"...low carrying capacity for wildlife and low carrying capacity for hunters.  Boy would l like to design and manage some of those public lands!

Land uses have changed the landscape and have drastically changed the carrying capacity for wildlife.  If you want to read a good book on a land use study and what happens...get a hold of "Pheasants of Iowa".  Amazing book and really got me going in my phylosophies for land management and habitat restoration.

Private companies offer tremendous opportunity to work with private landowners...and they pay taxes and offer job opportunities.  Over the past 7 years, my company has been under severe competition with government and non-profits that have started selling seed and services.  Why are government and non-profits using tax payer dollars to compete against private businesses that pay taxes and provide jobs?  Especially in this economic time!  You want a bigger bang for your tax payer dollar?  Then tell the government and non-profits to stop competing with private business and focus on education, promotion, fundraising and lobbying.  That is the team effort.  PF just stuck another Habitat Team in my front yard which means less business for private companies.  Do you think that makes me a little upset?  A non-profit using tax payer dollars to compete with existing private companies!  There is also a seperate "president" for this Habitat Team organization that gets paid $145,000 annually.  There are also "compensation of officers" of $254,000 annually.  This is not even to the $160,000 annually for "salaries and wages".  Not only is this organization competing with private businesses...they are also taking in some nice salaries...and it is only a $1.5 million a year budget for the organization.

As a tax payer that is upsetting.  As a small business owner trying to feed my family and send my kids to school...that is very upsetting.  One of the many things wrong with America.

Kyle, PLM
www.HabitatNOW.com

[deadeye]

Kyle,
I guess I never thought of this the way you explained it.  On the surface one would think setting up non profit offices like the one you described would be a good thing.  However, I certianly can see how it would negatively affect your business.  I wonder if these other organizations could get more bang for their buck by engaging your services rather than duplicate them?

[kenhuntin]

Ducks Unlimited does more restoration and conservation in the state of Minnesota than any other outfit out there. Even preserving pheasant habitat. If any state in the union does a waterfowl project it is not the U.S.F.W.S. or their respective department of natural resources. They turn to Ducks Unlimited engineers and biologists. Although D.U. does have a large living lakes initiative in Minnesota. It really makes little sense to spend $ here because Minnesota is not considered a breeding state. North Dakota and Canada Is where most of the waterfowl originate that Minnesota hunters bag. This is from the banding program and transmitter implants studying.Part of the philosophy is that if they do not leave their breeding or wintering grounds healthy you end up with zip.There are alot of little potholes around here where I live and they attract a fair amount of birds in the spring However the the dog walkers get a great amount of enjoyment from watching their house pets chase the ducks out of the little cattail ponds. I really think ducks could be extinct in 50 years. I look back to what has happened in my time with the influx of developed lakeshore and manicured lawns up to the waters edge. It is only a matter of time.http://www.ducks.org/Minnesota/MinnesotaProjects/1836/MinnesotaProjectsHome.html

[kenhuntin]

Every little bit anyone can do on their own land helps.
 If you have time click on the living Lakes  video. that one is my favorite

[LandDr]

I appreciate what non-profits do in regards to education, promotion, fundraising and lobbying.  BUT...when they start selling products and services, they cross the line.  Last time I checked this was America were we can work hard and see our dreams.  Mine has been a nightmare because long after we were in business, these government and non-profits started selling the same products and services taking away over 90% of our revenue.  Yes...over 90%!

Here is what my company did 3 years in a row...don't tell me any other organization did more...AND we did it on our own without grants, banquets, memberships and tax payer money...and...we pay taxes at the end of the year (govt. and non-profits don't pay taxes)

This is per year for 3 years straight...
- over 10,000 acres of native grass planted (a couple of years it was over 11,000 acre)
- around 200,000 trees for woody cover development (winter habitat)
- over 2,000 acre of wetlands restored
- numerous food plots
- numerous wildlife feeders
- numerous waterfowl nesting structures
etc., etc., etc.

And we did this on a $2.5 million budget and had over 50 employees.  That is extremely efficient and great job production...and huge results on the land.

In 2001, my county SWCD got 2 drills and started selling seed because 3 of the farmers on the board and their neighbors had some grass planting that needed to be done.  Instead of working with private business, they got drills using tax payer money and non-profit donations and started selling seed.

That year we had only 86 acres in my county!!  The county had over 2,000.
Next year we had 65 acres...the county had over 2,000.
Next year we had 34 acres...the county had over 2,000.
Next year we had 12.5 acres...the county had around 1900.
And so on and so on.

There was a post where a guy lost his job and everyone felt bad for him and tried helping him out.  Since 2001, I have had to lay off everyone except 3 full time and I do get a few part timers in the spring as I try to deal with these government and non-profits.  I may lose my job as well.  We happen to be VERY good at what we do...and we do it for a much much much larger bang for the taxpayer dollar.

It is time for everyone to know what these government and non-profits are doing...how they are competing with private business, taking away jobs, getting high salaries and doing all of this with our tax payer money and on the backs of volunteers.  How about some accountability and some respect for the hard working people...especially the ones that have small businesses, pay taxes, offer jobs, and are trying to feed their families and put their kids through school.

I am open any and all questions regarding this issue.  And I certainly appreciate your support.

Kyle, PLM
www.HabitatNOW.com

[stevejedlenski]

i think as mentioned before it is the farming practices that have led to the decline in population. i was talking to a wetlands enforcement officer and they said that minnesota had lin 90% or so of their wetlands drained and ND like 80 and SD like 40 or somthing like that. thats a fricken lot of wetlands that would hold ducks and habitat.

[GRIZ]

 Lots of good points made by all.

A couple things I don't agree with. Putting walleye in a pond will clean out the fatheads but once they are gone what do the walleyes eat. From my experience of 20 yrs in the bait bussiness planting eyes in a pond the first thing gone are the leeches then the fatheads. After that the walleyes will eat the shrimp. I seen it on a number of waters. My best producing minnow pond also had more shrimp than I've ever seen b4 or since. Also was a good leech producer. That was until the DNR planted eyes in there about 15 million of them. Took about a yr and a half b4 the minnows and shrimp were gone but the leeches went in about 3 months. The minnows, leeches and shrimp can coexist but not with the walleye.

Habitat detruction and modern farming practices take the biggest toll. Yrs ago low ground was either left be or pastured. If it was pastured some of the grassland around the pond may have been ate but the pond itslef was actually fertilized itself from the manure and run off of. Now they drain the ground and til it. If the pond didn't get drained run off consists of chemicals and herbicides that destroy plant and wildlife alike.

Kyle I like what you said about the gov should be held accountable and responsible. Prime example is this same pond that was such a good producer for me. How many walleye did the DNR get out of it Zero,Nadda,Zilch. I seen them doing it, went and asked them what they were doing? They said planting walleye fry. My reply back was how are you going to get them out. They said seine em. I told them it was impossible to pull a net through a forrest which is what the pond was. A jumble of logs and tree stumps on the bottom. They just said well we have to anyway cause they had a quota to plant so many. Who cares how many they plant, they should have the quotta on how many they take back out. It is instances like this that make our DNR so innefficient. No wonder private enterprise can raise walleye fingerlings for almost half what the state does. Your absolutely right goverment should leave some things to bussiness.

[LandDr]

Griz

Appreciate the comments.

I started PLM in 1994.  By 2001 I grew the business to having over 50 employees...paying taxes and being an asset to my community and economy.

Then in 2001, our local SWCD (government agency) got two native grass drills and started selling seed in direct competition with our existing business and other private businesses.  Other surrounding counties also did this.  Government using tax payer dollars to start up products and services to directly compete with private business...can you believe that!

In my county alone, we had planted 1,100 to 1,200 acres per year for three years.  When the county got drills and started selling seed, that year and the following we had 86, 65, 34 and 12.5 respectively.  The county had over 2,000 acres each year.  That represents over 90 percent of our local revenue lost because a government agency used tax payer dollars to start selling products and services in direct competition with private business!

I have been fighting this since 2001 but was forced to downsize to 3 employees in 2006...from 50 employees to 3 because of this issue.  And then they wonder why the unemployment rate goes up, we have a deficet and small businesses are not paying as much taxes and offering as many jobs.

I would appreciate anyone's support and even contacting your senators and reps to tell them to stop allowing SWCDs to compete with private businesses that are paying taxes, providing jobs and being assets to our communities and economies.  I have a list of contacts and some more really interesting information if anyone wants to send me an email at info@habitatnow.com...I will forward it to you.  Everyone should be in the know.

Thanks!

Kyle, PLM
www.HabitatNOW.com

[GRIZ]

It's about the same deal with a post I put on this topic. In efficiency

http://mnoutdoorsman.com/forums/index.php?topic=15618.0