Hunting Accident

[deadeye]

I'm sure the guy didn't head out that morning thinking he would do anything remotely close to what happend.  I agree he made some horrible mistakes that will stay with him for the rest of his life.  What I would like to see come out of this is that every one of us think of this every time we go out hunting.   This should be a constant reminder to all of us what can happen if we have even a very short laps in our judgement. 

[wildlifeminnesota]

But he should have not been hunting in the first place. No license, not have the owner’s permission, and 30 yard he should see him clearly! And you think he didn't head out that morning thinking he would do anything remotely close to what happend. Come on he was clearly was not to be out there in the first place and as far him not getting a license again. He didn’t have one in the first place this didn’t stop him then so what do you think it will stop him again. NO Bad choices I would say a lot of them and the big one was taking his boy hunting Because if he would have not got this would have not happen. It is people like this that make it hard for you and me. So yes I think he should go to jail and all his right should be taking away for good!! If you or I was out drinking and got in are car and kill some we will go to jail it is the same thing CAR or a GUN Because gun do not kill people do. Car do not kill people do and you and I are countable for what we do in life!!

[C.C. Waters]

  This is another post I've been biting my tongue on..   I've never been able to comprehend how anyone could mistakenly shoot a dog, cat, human, or whatever for there intended target.  You have to be a complete imbecile to do this. Do they snap shoot anything that moves?  shoot a patch of movement that resembles feathers or fur in the brush?  It happens every year, some dumb ass shoots someone!  It is why we have to wear brightly colored clothing.  This guy is not alone, I guess the hunter who actually makes sure of his target, and backstop are minority?


   This guy is an Anti-gun, Anti-Hunter's dream, and legitimately so,  I have difficulty feeling sorry for this fellow, his long list of bad decisions did not start the morning that changed his life forever.   I feel sorry for the boy who will not have a chance to grow up or experience life, I feel sorry for the Mom, for the Grandparents, Siblings. 

[Bobby Bass]

Give it a rest.... This man shot and killed his son.... There is nothing that will ever take that moment away from him till the day he dies. There is no punishment that can compare.

[JackpineRob]

I can't imagine what that family is going through. 

By now, most of us have read the news accounts - and understand that some very tragic mistakes were made. 

That father is going to wake up every day for the rest of his life knowing exactly what happened, and that he pulled the trigger.  Any punishment the law can dish out is going to be pale by comparison. 

Be careful with the comments folks - there is an entire family out there with a whole boatload of grief.  Lets not pile on.

[thunderpout]

I just hope you guys are right that he will remember it the rest of his life...but your right, there is no more need to say these same things again here... but what if a person didnt have a conscence like we do, then is it enough?  Just somthing to ponder....

[BK19]

From the KRBI Newsroom -- Wednesday, April 24, 2008
Belle Plaine – The DNR says a Belle Plaine man who fatally shot his 8-year-old son while turkey hunting on Saturday was hunting without a license. The DNR says Anthony Klaseus’ name was drawn in the license lottery for the five-day turkey season, but he never purchased the $18 license. The DNR say they have no plans to charge Klaseus.

[C.C. Waters]

Hey Bobby, if your post is intended to target me, just remember i have as much right to voice my opinion as you do...

[Bobby Bass]

Hey Bobby, if your post is intended to target me, just remember i have as much right to voice my opinion as you do...

Was not meant to target anyone. You will see it was posted three minutes after yours. I believe I was writing it as you were posting. And yes you have a right to say anything you want as do I. Don't read into any more then what I stated.

[JackpineRob]

If you've followed some of my stories and postings for awhile, you will notice that "Jr." has been a big part of most of my recent exploits.  He started tagging along when he was about 3 or 4 on the easy trips.  Sometimes we carried him in a Duluth pack on longer tromps through the brush, when his little legs couldn't keep up.

Partridge, ducks, pheasants and deer, turkeys and fishing trips - from the time he was able to comprehend how to hold a rod or hand shells to his old man, he has gone along - at least as much as I dared.

I've got a great pic of Jr. and the Old Dog - Jr. in his camo duds with red suspenders clutching a greenhead that darn near drags on the ground.  Jr. and the Old Dog sat back while I put the sneak on some mallards, and after the ballgame opened they came romping on in to help out.

Last Friday he had a diaphragm call in his yap, and did a pretty darn good job of calling as we worked the turkeys.  At 16 years old he has developed into a heck of an effective outdoorsman, and has won the respect and acceptance as a full participant not only from the family, but others he has ventured out with.

Some of the comments about this incident have called into question the notion of taking a youngster out into the woods - or chided the dad for leaving the kid alone.  Well folks, if taking a youngster out and at some point instructing him to stay put is a crime, paint me as a criminal.

Taking the kid out isn't the problem.  Leaving him may or may not have been a problem - none of us can guess what those two had done or how they had operated in the past.  For those of us now, hindsight is indeed 20-20.

The issue to me is quite simply one of gun safety.  I have burned into Jr.'s head from Day One that my very simple rule of guns is "SAFE DIRECTION".  Know where your gun is pointed, and what it is pointed at.  Sounds to me like for whatever reason, the Dad here didn't get that part right, and the cost is beyond anyone's wildest nightmares.

T-Pout wondered if the Dad would realize and have the conscience to comprehend the enormity of the whole thing.  As a Dad myself - and one who has devoted a lot of time to bringing my kids up to hunt and fish, I have no doubt on that issue whatsoever.

Its awfully easy for all of us to point fingers, offer criticism or call for the guy's head on a stick.  I wouldn't want to spend a minute in his shoes right now.

[deadeye]

Well said JackpineRob.  If any good can come of this it would be because a number of future accidents don't happen because this one did.

[thunderpout]

Jackpine... I didnt wonder so much as hope he did, as he definately overlooked his childs safety while in the act of  of bagging a bird.... theres no dought I would not be able to live with myself if I did such a thing, but then I would never hunt without a license, point a firearm OR ESPECIALLY shoot at something unidentified as he did, either....

[Tami]

I for one wont give it a rest...

Everyone has the right to voice their views..

Any news on this ?

I think this story ,(( i understand it ended tragically with a young lad dying,))  but it may help others as well too, therefore it is doing some good, to remind everyone, just just us members, but we have a lot of visitors here as well, if it educates one person and keeps one more child from being hurt then it did a great job...

and i say i am glad its here..

[EagleEyeJack]

This guy did not bother to engage his brain before he even set foot into the woods. I do not care if he wakes up for the rest of his life regretting what happened, if he had engaged his brain that would not be the case. To not punish him for what he did is a slap in the face of all hunters that pay attention to what they do while hunting. Would you feel the same if he had shot someone else? I for one, am sick and tired of these SLOB hunters, I want to see them punished for their behavior. We do not allow this foolishness when it comes to people that have Conceal Carry permits, why do we accept it when it comes to hunters with guns?

I hope that I never hear of something like this happening again, but unfortunately it will.

[Dancing Bear]

No License, trespassing, shoots at movement without identifying target, and they are calling it a "hunting accident".

That is not hunting.

Please change this post to

"Poaching Accident"  

Nuff said. DB

[GirlGuide]

I just have one thing to say on this...."Who are we to judge this situation?"  License or no license, whatever the situation was, I wasn't there, and neither were you.  We all have many different opinions on this, and when it comes down to it, do any of them really matter?  I'm not trying to justify anything the father did at all, I just have a heart, as I am sure so does the father.

...bottom line- A little boy is dead, it's unbelievably traggic...my heart goes out to him, his family AND his father.  May God Bless them all through this HORRIFIC ordeal!!!

gg

[Tami]

GG
we all have heart here for the family and the boy who was killed.
But we all know this happens way to much
And we all know we don't shot at something we cant see.
We all know not to hunt without a lic too,

judging someone who shot their son thinking it was a turkey?
judging someone out hunting with no lic?
judging someone on private land, posted land?
I am glad this post is here, it reminds us this happens a lot
I will judge, its people like him that gives us hunters a bad name..
and i will judge cause someday they might take my right to bare arms away cause of people like this..

just like i judge people who toss their beer cans in to the lake

no one is a saint, we all judge people even if you think you don't..

GG you just judged us..

that could have been you in the woods walking or anyone.. how would you judge that then?

I know i wouldn't want to get shot at, having someone think i was a turkey

well ok maybe some do think that.. but you get the point

ok i am done

I am glad no one has taken my free speech away and my right to view things.

[GirlGuide]

Gal,

In my post I did NOT judge you or any other's on this site.  I stated that ALL OF US HAVE DIFFERENT OPINIONS ON THIS MATTER.  My thoughts on this are,...at the end of the day, it does NOT matter on how we feel about what happened, because it is NOT going to change what already has happened.  I also stated that I was not trying to JUSTIFY anything that the father did.  I was trying to emphasize what a tragic and horrific thing this was that happened, and that my heart breaks for these people.  That is all!  I wasn't trying to point fingers at anyone for having different opinions then me, unlike you.  Apparently you are having a bad day, and felt like bashing me.  I like where you stated "no one is a saint, we all judge people even if you think you don't".  Apparently you didn't read the first sentence in my post where I stated "Who are WE to judge the situation.  WE includes MYSELF!!! 

Yes and let's compare someone tossing a beer can into a lake to a boy being shot...good analogy.

gg

[EagleEyeJack]

gg, it absolutely does matter. A child is dead because of this hunter, these things need to stop. And just because I do not tolerate stupid, does not make me heartless. I sympathize with the wife and family but NOT this guy. This is all his doing. Also, I did not need to be there to know what happened, it is obvious to all what happened. 

Do you all remember this one?

October, 2007 “Maplewood man was convicted of negligent manslaughter for shooting what he thought was a deer.” A hunter from Maplewood was convicted of negligent manslaughter Thursday for killing a 14-year-old hunter he mistook for a deer last year in a state forest north of Lake Mille Lacs.

Both are “unbelievably tragic” and both should receive the same treatment. The fact that it was his son should have no bearing on the matter.

I have wasted enough time on this topic, it is time to take it up with my legislators. BTW...I did not come to this site to fight about things but this shooting gets me very very PO’ed.

[Grute Man]

I don't think anyone came here to argue.  This is a tragedy and the only reason it was brought up was to encourage all hunters to be careful and not take things for granted.  We all hunt and fish because of one reason or another -- probably closely related to the thrill of the hunt.  If we all keep on our toes and remember safety first, then we can keep coming back for another hunt and so on.  One split second mistake like this one can change everything (not just hunting) for ever.

Lets all keep in mind that we're all on the same side, we all have differing opinions, and we all deal with things like this in our own way.

Grute

[thunderpout]

Yeah EEJ... I remember that one and others, the year before that there was an interesting one where a deer hunter shot and killed another hunter on a atv, not because he was mad at him or whatever you may have in your mind, but because he saw "movement"!  He thought the guy wearing blaze orange, putting along on a atv was a freakin deer!  I know we have hunter training now, but when I started hunting, ya didnt need to be certified... I dont know if thats the issue with these unbelievable, reoccuring, tragic "accidents" that happen every year, I just cant even try to figure it out... Maybe I just take for granted how my dad beat into my head the basics of gun saftey, and just take it that every one is as safe with a firearm as I am... The first two he always gave me were:  1)pretend every gun is loaded  2)Never point a gun at somthing ya dont intend to shoot.  These were put into my head as a child.  For those who have completed Firearms training, you know it goes farther than these two... but if these two were followed, two VERY simple rules... This latest "accident", and all others would never happen! Simple as that!  We can ponder till the end of time, the regret and sorrow of the people involved, but cut and dried a very stupid mistake is allways made that should have never happened.... Its too bad there isnt some kind of a common sense test of some kind isnt out there, because I just dont think training is just enough by itself Im afraid.... Untill then, when we just give keys to a motor vehicle or a gun to any human that basically wants one, people will keep killing other people "accidentally" because of the lack of judgement.... and a severe lack of common sense... And even worse, its usually not the person with the lack of common sense who gets their life taken away from them.

[Tami]

WOW i haven't heard of those...

Yeha like i said.. it happens far to much, once is to many..

and this thread is a reminder that things like this do happen.. and maybe this will save one more child..

cant stress safety first to much...

[Spinach]

Fact is, we are all pissed off that this tragedy happened and the others before.

What can we do to change this? What rules, tests or other ideas can be put in place to prevent as many stupid mistakes like this from happening in the future?

Some people should not be allowed to own or handle guns, let alone go hunting, lets face it, a lot of people in this world have some screws loose and are one day away from being sent to a padded room. Yet they can go out hunting alongside others that practice safety to a tee.

I feel terrible for the family, friends, boy and his father, but I still believe he should be punished for this, yes he will suffer for the rest of his life because he killed his son, an example needs to be made IMO. Abviously it will not help him, but possibly help others from making the same mistake.

No different than a drunk driver killing someone else, they are good people that made a huge mistake, but they are still punished and sent to prison.

[Tami]

What can be done?
How can we do something about this?
Any suggestions?

[Spinach]

For starters i'd like to see both of these ideas take place. I know most of us would consider this a waste of time and be reluctant, but even if it stopped 1-2 incidents per year, it would be worth my extra time.

1. Instead of taking the surveys when buying a license, the agent asking how many migratory birds did u shoot, how many pheasants, how many mergensers etc..... I'd like them to have to give each hunter a few questions/comments on gun safety, throw out a few mandatory reminders and have each one of us sign a safety paper at the counter. Each store or license seller would have to have a trained employee at the ELS at all times, they would have to be trained in how to train us for gun safety. This would only take a few extra seconds and we would all have that last minute reminder to be safe and aware of the shooting conditions.

2. All hunters should have to attend a mandatory safety meeting, where a 10 minute safety video is shown, the DNR would have to create a small video, I would be willing to have an extra safety tax included on my licenses or even a mandatory fee to attend the meeting. Maybe a one time fee of $2 each year would cover the costs.  The meetings would be held in each county across the state, every hunter would have to attend the mandatory safety meeting every 1-2-3 years or so. In order to get your license, you would have to have a certificate for attending the safety meeting.

I'm just thinking outloud...... But' i'm sure something like this would give us all a last minute reminder on gun safety. The last thing I want is for our licenses to go up and have more fees tacked on, but I would be all for a very small fee to cover these expenses.

The regular gun safety classes would stay the same too.

[Mayfly]

For starters i'd like to see both of these ideas take place. I know most of us would consider this a waste of time and be reluctant, but even if it stopped 1-2 incidents per year, it would be worth my extra time.

1. Instead of taking the surveys when buying a license, the agent asking how many migratory birds did u shoot, how many pheasants, how many mergensers etc..... I'd like them to have to give each hunter a few questions/comments on gun safety, throw out a few mandatory reminders and have each one of us sign a safety paper at the counter. Each store or license seller would have to have a trained employee at the ELS at all times, they would have to be trained in how to train us for gun safety. This would only take a few extra seconds and we would all have that last minute reminder to be safe and aware of the shooting conditions.

2. All hunters should have to attend a mandatory safety meeting, where a 10 minute safety video is shown, the DNR would have to create a small video, I would be willing to have an extra safety tax included on my licenses or even a mandatory fee to attend the meeting. Maybe a one time fee of $2 each year would cover the costs.  The meetings would be held in each county across the state, every hunter would have to attend the mandatory safety meeting every 1-2-3 years or so. In order to get your license, you would have to have a certificate for attending the safety meeting.

I'm just thinking outloud...... But' i'm sure something like this would give us all a last minute reminder on gun safety. The last thing I want is for our licenses to go up and have more fees tacked on, but I would be all for a very small fee to cover these expenses.

The regular gun safety classes would stay the same too.

Not a bad idea but this would not apply or help in this situation as the poacher did not even have a license.....

[kenhuntin]

No License, trespassing, shoots at movement without identifying target, and they are calling it a "hunting accident".

That is not hunting.

Please change this post to

"Poaching Accident"  

Nuff said. DB

I second the motion. Credit should be placed where it is due.  Thumbs up Dancing bear

[Tami]

I like those ideas...

for poaching its a fine and your gun taken away, and over the last few years your car as well i think..

I think jail time or something heftier should be enforced, it might scare some away..

You know when i used to own a paintball field, we made every new player sit  for a 10 min video on safety.. Taking off your mask is a big no no..

and when i seen people do something that could hurt them or others, like no barrel plugs leaving the field, i made them sit and watch it again..

then i went to..

 everyday i ran that video and made them watch it before they went on the field no matter how many times then came there, we stamped their hand, no stamp no play

so your idea is super, if we can do something like that with hunting lic.. all you need is a small tv, on the counter, and a tape.. before you hand them the lic just like you said they have to watch it.. even tho they might talk thought it or look around, they still can hear  the words safety safety.. maybe sink into their heads...

now if we can take this  to someone who will listen, to the ideas..

I wonder if we can make our own tape, from MNO lol of course and ask the outfitters to play it, i know a few outfitters here would do it in a heart beat before handing the lic.. even if it saves one person its worth it...

what do you think MNO Staff.. what about making a tape... good advertising for MNO as well..like i said i know 4 for sure who would play this, and they already have the  dvd player and tv, cause they have to watch a video before going out in the bwca..

[deadeye]

Pat, I love the idea of being read a few safety rules and signing a pledge to be safe.  Having a trained safety person at each els would be too expensive.  (it would be too costly for a mom and pop store). 
Also, I think the "refresher" saftey viedo is a good Idea.  Maybe every 5 years like the defensive driving course.  Larger stores like Gander, Cabelas, Joes etc, could just have it on hand for people to watch.

Good thinking there Pat!

[Spinach]

I was thinking that in order to have an ELS  and in order to lease the equipment from the DNR, the store should have a certain amount of employees be trained in a simple class for safety. Something like a 30 minute video that they can use to retrain the license buyers at the counter.

No extra costs except for the making of the videos, the store would be responsible for paying for the employees training.

I know the stores only make like a dollar from the sale of a license, but the people buying licenses are also buying ammo, guns, scent, clothing etc..... If they dont cooperate with the employee safety training, they cant sell licenses. Only a certain percentage of employees would have to obtain the training, but everyone selling licenses most attend.

Thats sort of what I was thinking.