Baiting dilemma.

[deadeye]

Yesterday I ventured down to the souther end of my property.  I wanted to check out a big stand that a guy had built a few years ago.  It's a monster stand (a 4X8 fully enclosed metal structure).  The guy that built this is a brother in law to the land owner.  When he first erected this, he put it on my property and made a food plot.  I ask him to move it and he did.  Now it is about 10 feet from the property line.  He has since made a faily large food plot around the stand.   While following a trail that leads to the stand, I found shelled corn and soybeans.   Corn cobs (now empty cobs) were spread around the permiter of the food plot.  I think he was carfull not to put any on my property.  The big question is what to do now.
1. Call and report it to the local CO.
2. Anonymously send him a copy of the "baiting restrictions".
3. Anonymously send the land owner a copy of the  "baiting restrictions".
4. Call the guy and let him know I disaprove of his baiting and ask him to stop.
5. Call the land owner and let him know about the illegal activities on his property.
6. Post a sign at the enterance of the trail that says "Deer baiting on this propery, hunt at your own risk".

I doubt reporting would do any good because this is about a mile from a road and would require the CO to catch him hunting there.  An anonymous letter my get him worried enough to stop baiting.  His brother in law may take action to stop him.   

[dakids]

Call the CO and give him all of the info (names, phone #)  Let him make the call.  Nothing like a cop scaring someone straight.

[beeker]

if you like the neighbor I would just tell him that this guy is baiting on his property. if he does nothing let the CO handle it.

[Bobby Bass]

Stick a  copy of the "baiting restrictions in his door handle, that way he will see someone was there and saw his baiting. Odds are he will just continue doing it. If he has this food plot is there really much difference between growing a food plot and bring in some more feed to scatter around? Don't want to open a can of worms here in regards to food plots, I am sure a lot of people have the intent to help the herd but there are some who are doing it just to being deer in to shooting range. 

[backwoods]

Now that you know its there, you have an absolute legal obligation to turn him in.  If you do not and you allow it, you are equally as liable as he is for the infractions that he incurs from this  point forward.

Call the CO, give him ALL the info and dont even waffle.  Do it. Now.


Side note: These weasels that bait animals to shoot them anger me as much as the punks that pulled 9/11.  Anyone that doesnt have the stones and patience to hunt like a sportsman doesn't deserve to be allowed back in the woods.  Period.  I am sick and tired of what used to be high standards for sportsman being relaxed more and more to justify almost anything in the name of bringing home a trophy.

[BiggA]

I agree with backwoods, also if I am not mistaken if you hunt your property knowing there is a trail leading to bait you can be cited for the baiting. It is upp to the CO's discretion to decide. People like that guy give us all a bad name.

[bowhunter73]

I think some of us are missing the point this guy is just an a$$ plain and simple
 
1st   he put his stand on your land.
 
2nd   when asked to move it he only went just over the line (still trespassing in my book because you know he is going to shoot over the line)

3rd    he is illegally baiting and putting a neighbor and legal hunter at risk

I would call the CO and give them as much info as I had! Also, you know the landowner knows what is going on. He probable has his own pile on the other side of the land

             Sick and tired or hunters like this
             they should sell tags for them to
             help reduce there #s

[beeker]

as far as a high standard.. just like in society you have your classes.. and I think the same goes for hunting.
you have the ethical hunter who hunts for the pure love of it, they play by the rules.
 you have your casual hunters who goe out on opener and maybe one other day,
then you got the lazy hunter who baits and covers themselves in every product out there thinking it gives them an edge and they wonder why they never get anything other than a spiker every year and eventually they end up ordering some replica antlers from ebay.
then you got the poacher/shoot em in the headlights cut out the backstraps guy

I'm sure I missed some but I don't think this scenario hasn't changed much since the beggining of time. I'm sure at some point Groggg was mad at Ughhhu for dumping mammoth guts in order to get a sabor tooth. (groff was mad because the cave girls were digging the guys with sabor tooth necklaces)

[HD]

DE, I think you already know where I stand on this question...........

You found it, and as stated in a previous post, you will also be liable if you don't say something.

It is a pickle my friend...............

I feel for ya man!


Hunter

[backwoods]

I put baiters in the exact same category as I put someone that shoots wolves, for any reason.  Spineless, worthless to the sporting community and a vicious excuse for a sportsman. 

Someone that thinks that they need to bait to shoot a deer, or that wolves need to be killed so that "their deer population can grow" is as paleolithic as a hunter gets.  They are, in fact, nothing more than *killers* and throwbacks from the stone age.

( I know, I know, I have a tendency to candycoat things, and its only because I am so PC and concerned that someone may take offense to how I feel and think.  I can be more direct if you would prefer...?      :)  )

[deadeye]

I don't think I have an absolute legal obligation to turn him in.  I also don't think I will be equally as liable as he is for the infractions that he incurs from this  point forward.  However, I do think I should do something.  If at all possible I would like to resolve it without the CO's involvement.  I think it would be too late for this year as I don't know if he is still hunting there.  However, I do know his brother in law (the landowner) bow hunts there.  I think I will tell them that the area is now a no hunting zone and if I see anyone hunting that property, I will have to report it.  That would basically end their season and give them something to think about next year. 

[HUNTER2]

Was the food plot a corn field? Because squirrels and deer will carry the cobs a considerable distance. I have a neighbor that had a corn field and there was cobs on my property that were about 200 yards away. My nephew saw a big red squirrel carry one by him in his stand one night.

[deadeye]

Good thought but no, it was clover and winter wheat.  No corn or beans. 

[backwoods]

Well, Deadeye, its like this.  You came here wanting to share your story and get input.

Heres mine:

I say that if you allow the guy or hunters to continue, all you have done is reinforced their illegal habits, and taught them that there are no liabilities for breaking the law.  This isnt a grey area, these guys intentionallly put food under their stand for the sole purpose of luring deer in to shoot.

Lastly, when you bring a subject up on a site like this, you open a can of worms.  I wouldn't be surprised if by now the DNR already knows about this situation and is planning to look into it on their own.  I hope they do.

[Go Big Red!]

Since MN outlaws baiting, call the CO.  Best case, he is nailed for baiting.  Worse case scenario, he is now "on watch" and he will always be wondering if someone is watching him.

Now, in regards to baiting.  WI allows it in certain areas except for the CWD Mgt. zone.  Have I hunted near a bait pile?  Yes.  Did I ever shoot a deer feeding from it?  No.  Do I currently hunt with/over bait?  No.

Would you, if allowed, hunt over bait? 

[Pegg]

Just for posting it on here there might be a CO on here and may already be getting info. 

I say turn him in. Better that way. Because if you hunt the line you know the bait is there and would get all your gear takin and tagged.

Just my 2 cents

Good luck with what ever you do.

[SMIGRATOR]

DEADEYE, I think before i went and started pointing fingers @ someone on here " a open forum" i would look at yourself, you have stated that you have taken 2 Nice Bucks this year, i think the dnr only allows for 1 to be taken per year, so did you party hunt because you said nothing about that. So now you tell me what i should do, should i and everyone on this site turn you in because you shot 2 bucks this year. Here are the post that you made after taking both the deer.

Quote from: deadeye on November 12, 2008, 10:19:07 PM
I went out again today and managed to out smart this nice 8 pointer.   I just saw him for a short time about 80 yards away moving in the thick brush.  I did my best grunt-snort-wheeze and he responded by showing me what a REAL grunt-snort-wheeze should sound like.  I tried again and he responded from a different location.  This went on for a couple minutes while he made a circle around me.  Finally he stepped onto a trail and because I had my gun up and ready, I was able to get off a quick shot.   I guess I'm not going hunting tomorrow but will try again Friday.

Quote from: deadeye on November 17, 2008, 12:14:46 PM
Looks like I picked the right place to go hunting on Friday.   This dandy 13 point 180 pound buck came by at 9:00 AM.  Funny thing is he was running with a doe and a possibly bigger buck. 

[Moving2thecountry]

I put baiters in the exact same category as I put someone that shoots wolves, for any reason.  Spineless, worthless to the sporting community and a vicious excuse for a sportsman. 

Someone that thinks that they need to bait to shoot a deer, or that wolves need to be killed so that "their deer population can grow" is as paleolithic as a hunter gets.

The two wolve examples are not consistent.  In the second case, I think I agree with you.  In the first case, self-defense seems reasonable, but I suppose you'd offer yourself up for wolf and country. 

What a patriot.

[backwoods]

Sure.  Tell the group how many times you have been threatened by a wolf, will you?

How many hunters have been killed by wolves in the last 25 yrs?  Hmmm?  Does the number zero sound about right?

The was no comparison.  I was stating that I thought anyone that shoots wolves, claiming to be saving the deer herd,  OR hunting deer over bait, isnt a sportsman.  Anything can be twisted out of context to start an argument, but I wont play that game.

[dakids]

Another way to look at it DE.  What if the big buck that you shot this year was shot by the neighbor and his bait pile?  Would that make you mad?  Maybe he shot a bigger one?   If he did it this year he WILL do it next year.  I would bet that the other guys in his party also do it.  They say him with his big bucket of corn and probably thought if he can do it so will I.  It will eventually affect you.  Call the CO.  If they harvested a deer over the bait and the CO can get the party to admit or turn against one another they will get pinched. 

If they use bait do they also use a spotlight?

[flaursen]

The regs state that you are allowed to bait or feed up to a month before the hunting season and you are not allowed to take a animal heading to the feeder so if the trail goes from your property to that spot you can and will be held responsible so in my opinion not only has created a problem from himself but for you too cause now was that deer on his way to the plot ????? at the very least I would talk to the land owner but in the sake of yourself I report it to the CO atleast your butt is covered....... most of the co's that I know are hunters and can see the delema that you would be in and could offer some insight to rectify it with out all the paper work

[deadeye]

SMIGRATOR,
I suspose It's true you could pick out a few posts and link them together to imply that I just go violating laws while complaining about others doing the same, but that's just not the case.  Any one who has read my posts over the past few months would have the full picture.  For instance the post about passing on a 2.5 year old 8 point.  I gave a couple reasons, one of which was I didn't want to end my buck hunting season. (I was hunting alone at the time).  Then there's the post on the "how did you do" thread that describes how eight of use did during the gun season.  Seems to me that if eight of us got three bucks, there should be enough buck tags to go around.  And finally, if still thinks differently, I have pictures of others with both of the bucks I shot which should pretty much prove they were with me.  By the way, no offense taken by your post as I can see how someone could reach that conclusion.  
I'm heading out today to try and find "catch" the guy who I assume placed the bait.  

[deadeye]

flaursen,
I may not have made it clear.  The trail going in is actually on the border between the properties.  I think you must remove "all" residue of bait 10 days prior to hunting the area.  This has not been done as evidence still exists. 
I doubt CO read these forums to catch violators.  It's possible and I'm sure they wouldn't have too much of a hard time to locate "me" and then go from there.  I'm also pretty sure they don't go chasing every red herring that's posted on forums and blogs.   

[ChrisWallace]

Yesterday I ventured down to the souther end of my property.  I wanted to check out a big stand that a guy had built a few years ago.  It's a monster stand (a 4X8 fully enclosed metal structure).  The guy that built this is a brother in law to the land owner.  When he first erected this, he put it on my property and made a food plot.  I ask him to move it and he did.  Now it is about 10 feet from the property line.  He has since made a faily large food plot around the stand.   While following a trail that leads to the stand, I found shelled corn and soybeans.   Corn cobs (now empty cobs) were spread around the permiter of the food plot.  I think he was carfull not to put any on my property.  The big question is what to do now.

so did you trespass to see the food plot and the shelled corn cobs on the trail?

[Moving2thecountry]

Sure.  Tell the group how many times you have been threatened by a wolf, will you?

How many hunters have been killed by wolves in the last 25 yrs?  Hmmm?  Does the number zero sound about right?

The was no comparison.  I was stating that I thought anyone that shoots wolves, claiming to be saving the deer herd,  OR hunting deer over bait, isnt a sportsman.  Anything can be twisted out of context to start an argument, but I wont play that game.

I've not even seen a wild wolf in Minnesota.  My wife and I have seen a cougar crossing the highway 61 north of two harbors in the middle of the night 8 years ago--the car in front of us saw it too, because he slowed down.  Nobody believes us about that sighting.

Anyway, what do you think about hunting over food plots?

I don't think it is "sporting" either.  Neither is hunting over bait piles, in my view.  So I don't do it.  I have a friend who hunted a bear over a bait pile.  Seemed to not be sporting.  To each his own.  But then again, I fish with live bait from time to time--though I won't fish for musky with suckers--I will fish for Walleye with leeches.  It's not really fair, but Walleye are tasty.

As for hunting deer over a bait pile, it is not legal. 

Asking how many hunters have been killed by wolves is like asking how many on-duty police officers have been robbed by a deranged but unarmed thirteen year old--it just ain't gonna happen.

You're the one making overly broad and argument inviting statements.  Not me.

[deadeye]

"so did you trespass to see the food plot and the shelled corn cobs on the trail?"  I was wondering how long it would take before someone brought this up. 
Like I said the trail is on the property borders and the stand is only 10 feet off the property line.  I could see the bait without going on the property but I did go on it for a closer look.

[Outdoors Junkie]

"so did you trespass to see the food plot and the shelled corn cobs on the trail?"  I was wondering how long it would take before someone brought this up. 
Like I said the trail is on the property borders and the stand is only 10 feet off the property line.  I could see the bait without going on the property but I did go on it for a closer look.

I am guessing your neighbor doesn't have no trespassing signs posted in that area.  Then is shouldn't be an issue to take a closer look when you see something from your own property.

As far as your earlier questions.  I would ask the land owner if he is aware that his brother in law is doing illegal baiting on his property.  I am sure the land owner will take steps to correct this issue after he knows you know it has been happening.  If it continues after that, I would then contact the CO. 

Who wants to start a big fued with a neighbor and have to deal with that drama? 

Give the neighbor the benefit of the doubt and let him know you know shady things are going on by his brother in law.  This day and age we just don't communicate like we used to.  We tend to make a bigger deal out of things then we need to.  Why get a CO involved without talking with him first?  The land owner might not know what is going on.

[beeker]

signs or no signs.. doesn't matter...

this is from the regulations book.
Any entry onto the private property of another without permission is considered
trespass. Landowners may be able to pursue court action against trespassers
whether the property is posted or not.

so just because there is no sign doesn't give you permission to wander around at will.

[Outdoors Junkie]

signs or no signs.. doesn't matter...

this is from the regulations book.
Any entry onto the private property of another without permission is considered
trespass. Landowners may be able to pursue court action against trespassers
whether the property is posted or not.

so just because there is no sign doesn't give you permission to wander around at will.

Thanks for looking that up beeker. 

The neighbor obviously does not have the bounderies marked and DE is the only one who has a good idea where the property line is at.  I don't think DE would have to worry about any actions taken against him from walking less then ten feet onto the neighbors property with no bounderies marked.  The brother in law is originally trespassed onto DE's property and put up a stand on DE's land.

Maybe DE has permission to walk onto the neighbors property?  I don't know?

I suppose we can keep getting stuck on the small dot of these off topic items.  It seems to me that DE started this original topic to get some opinions from other MNO members about what actions to take with the brother in law and neighbor.  The next thing that happens in this thread is that people are attacking him for shooting too many bucks (which he did not do because he party hunts) and trespassing? 

It is a little frustrating to read through some of these replies.

Let's get back to the original post.

Yesterday I ventured down to the souther end of my property.  I wanted to check out a big stand that a guy had built a few years ago.  It's a monster stand (a 4X8 fully enclosed metal structure).  The guy that built this is a brother in law to the land owner.  When he first erected this, he put it on my property and made a food plot.  I ask him to move it and he did.  Now it is about 10 feet from the property line.  He has since made a faily large food plot around the stand.   While following a trail that leads to the stand, I found shelled corn and soybeans.   Corn cobs (now empty cobs) were spread around the permiter of the food plot.  I think he was carfull not to put any on my property.  The big question is what to do now.
1. Call and report it to the local CO.
2. Anonymously send him a copy of the "baiting restrictions".
3. Anonymously send the land owner a copy of the  "baiting restrictions".
4. Call the guy and let him know I disaprove of his baiting and ask him to stop.
5. Call the land owner and let him know about the illegal activities on his property.
6. Post a sign at the enterance of the trail that says "Deer baiting on this propery, hunt at your own risk".

I doubt reporting would do any good because this is about a mile from a road and would require the CO to catch him hunting there.  An anonymous letter my get him worried enough to stop baiting.  His brother in law may take action to stop him.   

DE seems like a straight shooter to me.  He has shared a lot of great knowledge on this site and I respect him for that.  I truly believe he is a true sportsman. 

I am guessing he posted this subject because he doesn't want to call the CO and get his neighbor and the neighbors brother in law in trouble.  DE doesn't want these illegal activities to continue, so he is reaching out to his fellow MNO members for advice or opinions on the subject.

Lets be respectful and help DE out.

[HUNTER2]

AMEN, I'll second that.