Do you support Antler Point Regs??

[jigglestick]

"we have so much cover its easy for them to dissapear"
Yah if this was only true come to swmn and see what we have for cover.

I have been to swmn pheasant hunting many times and many times I wished I was carrying a rifle instead.
I saw more horns down there hunting shelterbelts and cats than I ever saw in a season up here.

I would love to have a three day hunt down there especially after the corn is out.

[HUNTER2]

There is just to many people down here that say if its brown its down. There is also people that push every little piece of land they have and shoot everything that moves and then count the doe tags afterwords. I am finaly starting to get the nephew to start passing on the little ones. The neighbor was out looking for antlers the other day and found 3 or 4 dead deer carcuses. I'm guessing they were wounded by the push and shoot theory and never even looked for.

[Mayfly]

I don't agree with the comments about managing deer and our resources in relation to out personal freedoms and more involvement of government etc.... You cannot deny that our resources need to be managed to some extent. Imagine if there was no organization involved and no one to stand up for our basic rights to hunt and fish. There will be and always has been (in our lifetime) a governing of these resources. Management plans are just that...management plans. Ways to better manage our deer herd, pheasant population and fisheries. Some agree and some do not. All I say is give them a chance, there has been little to no management on the MN deer herd in my lifetime and the little they have done has not produced a healthy herd by any means. The only management they have implemented is population control. There are too many deer... ok we need more doe tags this year, there are not enough deer and people are complaining... ok cut back on doe tags. Another issue here is cross tagging and party hunting. Shoot your own buck!!! That one needs to be thrown out state-wide. That's a whole separate conversation. Probably the MOST ABUSED regulations or law out there. Wives, kids, girlfriends and other family members buying tags so you can shoot that buck if he happens to come by you. 

[The General]

The neighbor was out looking for antlers the other day and found 3 or 4 dead deer carcuses. I'm guessing they were wounded by the push and shoot theory and never even looked for.

Um. "WE DON"T KNOW THAT".

Just because people don't hunt the way you do doesn't mean they just shoot blindly and to say they wouldn't go looking for their deer..........wow.  When you hit a deer with a slug you know just by the sound.

[kenhuntin]

 Another issue here is cross tagging and party hunting. Shoot your own buck!!! That one needs to be thrown out state-wide. That's a whole separate conversation. Probably the MOST ABUSED regulations or law out there. Wives, kids, girlfriends and other family members buying tags so you can shoot that buck if he happens to come by you.  
[/quote]
 What you are referring to here is poaching not party hunting. You are also down right stating that passing more laws does not work.

[nic53]

I don't agree with the comments about managing deer and our resources in relation to out personal freedoms and more involvement of government etc.... You cannot deny that our resources need to be managed to some extent. Imagine if there was no organization involved and no one to stand up for our basic rights to hunt and fish. There will be and always has been (in our lifetime) a governing of these resources. Management plans are just that...management plans. Ways to better manage our deer herd, pheasant population and fisheries. Some agree and some do not. All I say is give them a chance, there has been little to no management on the MN deer herd in my lifetime and the little they have done has not produced a healthy herd by any means. The only management they have implemented is population control. There are too many deer... ok we need more doe tags this year, there are not enough deer and people are complaining... ok cut back on doe tags. Another issue here is cross tagging and party hunting. Shoot your own buck!!! That one needs to be thrown out state-wide. That's a whole separate conversation. Probably the MOST ABUSED regulations or law out there. Wives, kids, girlfriends and other family members buying tags so you can shoot that buck if he happens to come by you. 

Well put! Agree totally with it all! The cross tagging really needs to stop!

[HD]

Just a question....

How would you go about policing the cross tagging?

[jigglestick]

I don't agree with the comments about managing deer and our resources in relation to out personal freedoms and more involvement of government etc.... You cannot deny that our resources need to be managed to some extent. Imagine if there was no organization involved and no one to stand up for our basic rights to hunt and fish. There will be and always has been (in our lifetime) a governing of these resources. Management plans are just that...management plans. Ways to better manage our deer herd, pheasant population and fisheries. Some agree and some do not. All I say is give them a chance, there has been little to no management on the MN deer herd in my lifetime and the little they have done has not produced a healthy herd by any means. The only management they have implemented is population control. There are too many deer... ok we need more doe tags this year, there are not enough deer and people are complaining... ok cut back on doe tags. Another issue here is cross tagging and party hunting. Shoot your own buck!!! That one needs to be thrown out state-wide. That's a whole separate conversation. Probably the MOST ABUSED regulations or law out there. Wives, kids, girlfriends and other family members buying tags so you can shoot that buck if he happens to come by you. 

what other form of management do we need? population is where it's at.

I agree about cross tagging. it just irks me when someone posts up pictures of the "bucks" they shot last year and the right away add the (party hunting) disclaimer.
you want more control on the number of bucks that are harvested, do it that way and yes they can crack down on it. it would be tedious and most of the time you won't "get your man" but some tmes they will and they need to fine BOTH parties. the husband AND the wife.
I have party hunted and I have cross tagged, but I have come to a mind set over the years that it's not the way to do it and would gladly support a law prohibitting cross tagging.

[dakids]

I'm still on the fence on point restrictions.  I hate being told what I can and can't shoot, But I don't like the fact that a lot of the young bucks get shot every year also.  Good points on both sides.  All parts of the state are differant and I have hunted in them all.  I prefer the north because I hate deer drives.  Almost been shot a couple of times.  Never again. 

Let the zone 3 trial run its course.  After 3 years we will see if people start to change their opinions.  There are big bucks out there, the hard part is getting a good shot at them.  Point restrictions are not the answer for all problems.  Just because you can't shoot little dumb bucks doesn't meen that you will be able to shoot them when they get bigger and smarter. 

[The General]

I agree with the "buy my wife a tag (who doesn't hunt) and shooting a deer for her" which is illegal anyway and cracking down on this more.  But outlawing party hunting is  .  I'm not sure where you guys are from but around here this is how most everyone hunts.  I haven't hunted this way for 15 years, but again just because this isn't the way I hunt it is legal and should be in my opinion.  When my son and daughter come of age to hunt deer whether we party hunt together using a gun or bow I will gladly pass on anything that isn't an absolute wall hanger and let one of them shoot another deer to fill my tag.  

[nic53]

I agree with the "buy my wife a tag (who doesn't hunt) and shooting a deer for her" which is illegal anyway and cracking down on this more.  But outlawing party hunting is  .  I'm not sure where you guys are from but around here this is how most everyone hunts.  I haven't hunted this way for 15 years, but again just because this isn't the way I hunt it is legal and should be in my opinion.  When my son and daughter come of age to hunt deer whether we party hunt together using a gun or bow I will gladly pass on anything that isn't an absolute wall hanger and let one of them shoot another deer to fill my tag.  

I'm from central minnesota and a lot of people party hunt this area. To me there is 2 different types of party hunting. A) A party that pushes every little bit of land they can. B) A party that sits in stands but share tags. I am very against them both for many reasons here are a couple.
1. Safety! (not saying all party hunters are not safe, but i have heard plenty of close calls)
2. Their is a reason for bag limits! If your area calls for one deer then take only your one deer!
3. Would increase the number of mature deer taken!
4. Its a way to manage the deer herd!

[The General]

I agree with the "buy my wife a tag (who doesn't hunt) and shooting a deer for her" which is illegal anyway and cracking down on this more.  But outlawing party hunting is  .  I'm not sure where you guys are from but around here this is how most everyone hunts.  I haven't hunted this way for 15 years, but again just because this isn't the way I hunt it is legal and should be in my opinion.  When my son and daughter come of age to hunt deer whether we party hunt together using a gun or bow I will gladly pass on anything that isn't an absolute wall hanger and let one of them shoot another deer to fill my tag.  

I'm from central minnesota and a lot of people party hunt this area. To me there is 2 different types of party hunting. A) A party that pushes every little bit of land they can. B) A party that sits in stands but share tags. I am very against them both for many reasons here are a couple.
1. Safety! (not saying all party hunters are not safe, but i have heard plenty of close calls)
2. Their is a reason for bag limits! If your area calls for one deer then take only your one deer!
3. Would increase the number of mature deer taken!
4. Its a way to manage the deer herd!

If you party hunt in a group of six and everyone has a lic you can take six deer for the group.  If all six people hunted individually they could still take six deer.  I don't think any of your 4 points make an sense, but I could be misunderstanding what you're saying too.  As far as using safety as a reason..........guess people should stop driving cars then because not all drivers are safe either.   

[nic53]

I agree with the "buy my wife a tag (who doesn't hunt) and shooting a deer for her" which is illegal anyway and cracking down on this more.  But outlawing party hunting is  .  I'm not sure where you guys are from but around here this is how most everyone hunts.  I haven't hunted this way for 15 years, but again just because this isn't the way I hunt it is legal and should be in my opinion.  When my son and daughter come of age to hunt deer whether we party hunt together using a gun or bow I will gladly pass on anything that isn't an absolute wall hanger and let one of them shoot another deer to fill my tag.  

I'm from central minnesota and a lot of people party hunt this area. To me there is 2 different types of party hunting. A) A party that pushes every little bit of land they can. B) A party that sits in stands but share tags. I am very against them both for many reasons here are a couple.
1. Safety! (not saying all party hunters are not safe, but i have heard plenty of close calls)
2. Their is a reason for bag limits! If your area calls for one deer then take only your one deer!
3. Would increase the number of mature deer taken!
4. Its a way to manage the deer herd!

If you party hunt in a group of six and everyone has a lic you can take six deer for the group.  If all six people hunted individually they could still take six deer.  I don't think any of your 4 points make an sense, but I could be misunderstanding what you're saying too.  As far as using safety as a reason..........guess people should stop driving cars then because not all drivers are safe either.   

You are allowed to have your opinion and i am one to respect that. But i am very vocal and will let it be known how i feel on subjects like this one. I have been doing a lot of research on this lately and a lot of articles list 3 out of the 4 reasons i gave so to some people it makes perfect sense. Not the safety one though but that is just one i personally worry about when i hear friends say they had bullets zipping past there head. Yes its not every group but i have heard it from more then just a couple. This is a discussion that could go on forever cuz everyone has a different view of it. And I am just expressing mine.

"A survey of southeast deer hunters last year showed them about evenly split over the issue: 53 percent supported regulations to protect a majority of yearling bucks and 50 percent supported requiring hunters to shoot and tag their own bucks"

[naturalistmn]

I don't agree with the comments about managing deer and our resources in relation to out personal freedoms and more involvement of government etc.... You cannot deny that our resources need to be managed to some extent. Imagine if there was no organization involved and no one to stand up for our basic rights to hunt and fish. There will be and always has been (in our lifetime) a governing of these resources. Management plans are just that...management plans. Ways to better manage our deer herd, pheasant population and fisheries. Some agree and some do not. All I say is give them a chance, there has been little to no management on the MN deer herd in my lifetime and the little they have done has not produced a healthy herd by any means. The only management they have implemented is population control. There are too many deer... ok we need more doe tags this year, there are not enough deer and people are complaining... ok cut back on doe tags. Another issue here is cross tagging and party hunting. Shoot your own buck!!! That one needs to be thrown out state-wide. That's a whole separate conversation. Probably the MOST ABUSED regulations or law out there. Wives, kids, girlfriends and other family members buying tags so you can shoot that buck if he happens to come by you. 

+1 

[The General]

I agree with the "buy my wife a tag (who doesn't hunt) and shooting a deer for her" which is illegal anyway and cracking down on this more.  But outlawing party hunting is  .  I'm not sure where you guys are from but around here this is how most everyone hunts.  I haven't hunted this way for 15 years, but again just because this isn't the way I hunt it is legal and should be in my opinion.  When my son and daughter come of age to hunt deer whether we party hunt together using a gun or bow I will gladly pass on anything that isn't an absolute wall hanger and let one of them shoot another deer to fill my tag.  

I'm from central minnesota and a lot of people party hunt this area. To me there is 2 different types of party hunting. A) A party that pushes every little bit of land they can. B) A party that sits in stands but share tags. I am very against them both for many reasons here are a couple.
1. Safety! (not saying all party hunters are not safe, but i have heard plenty of close calls)
2. Their is a reason for bag limits! If your area calls for one deer then take only your one deer!
3. Would increase the number of mature deer taken!
4. Its a way to manage the deer herd!

If you party hunt in a group of six and everyone has a lic you can take six deer for the group.  If all six people hunted individually they could still take six deer.  I don't think any of your 4 points make an sense, but I could be misunderstanding what you're saying too.  As far as using safety as a reason..........guess people should stop driving cars then because not all drivers are safe either.  

You are allowed to have your opinion and i am one to respect that. But i am very vocal and will let it be known how i feel on subjects like this one. I have been doing a lot of research on this lately and a lot of articles list 3 out of the 4 reasons i gave so to some people it makes perfect sense. Not the safety one though but that is just one i personally worry about when i hear friends say they had bullets zipping past there head. Yes its not every group but i have heard it from more then just a couple. This is a discussion that could go on forever cuz everyone has a different view of it. And I am just expressing mine.

"A survey of southeast deer hunters last year showed them about evenly split over the issue: 53 percent supported regulations to protect a majority of yearling bucks and 50 percent supported requiring hunters to shoot and tag their own bucks"

Well please explain if you and I are party hunting together and you shoot your deer and mine that equals a total of 2.  Yet if we each hunt separately and get our deer we again shot 2.  I don't understand what you're talking about in regards to bag limits.  Each person purchased a tag and we each got our tag filled one way or the other.  Either limit the amount of tags that are available for purchase or don't complain that all tags purchased are filled.

[MTCOMMER]

Like I said before - just give it a shot for the next 2 years and see what happens.  Cross tagging, party hunting, etc is a whole separate issue.

On our land we have seen rewards of passing on smaller deer - we have been seeing more bucks than ever before and more quality bucks.  Our neighbors sold a few years ago and the new owners only shoot BIG does and BIG bucks, they will no shoot anything less than 8 points, and sometimes pass up 8 pointers and allow them to grow.  Another neighbor used to have big groups (15 people) come hunt and it sounded like a war zone over there - they would shoot ANYTHING.  and lastly, we havent been shooting 'small' does, we havent taken any nubbin bucks over the last few years.

All that has added up to bigger bucks, and more bucks - and I have been lucky enough to harvest 2 nice ones the last 2 years.  Over the last 20years before that, there was nothing of that caliber running around due to "if its brown its down".
So that is an argument for the restrictions.

But I am still on the fence about the issue - I would survive if it was implemented in our area, I really dont mind since I would pass up a 6 pointer for a doe anyday.

[deadeye]

One thing to remember is that a minority position can win the vote.  A good example is the last election.  Dayton won the election with 43% of the vote.  If this was a vote on APR, that group would have won out even though they were the minority.  Do I think letting small bucks go is a good idea, hell yes.  Do I think it shoud be mandated, hell no.  Over all the benefits really do outweigh the negative impacts.  This is again my opinion but backed up by many years of experience hunting both ways.