Rifle Scope Questions

[Grute Man]

OK you bench shooters, this is for you. 

My son has a brand new Ruger M77 Hawkeye in the 25.06 caliber.  I was thumbing through the manual and it said to get a scope with a 7-15 eye relief.  Not knowing if that was good, bad or indifferent, I went to a local gun shop and the guy said I was asking for a lot.  Really?  What's the big deal?

All I know is that this is his first deer season and I want him to be able to sight this thing in well so he's confident with it.

Any recomendations?

Grute 

[Super Star!]

Grute,,,

check out he Zeiss scopes they have on that is in the 280 dollar range that is a very nice scope for a first timer.

[Cody Gruchow]

nikon all the way

[tripnchip]

grute, what little i know about scopes that is a lot of eye relief difference.I have never seen one with that much difference but then it has been along time sinc ei have lookedat new scopes. now if you have mixed up eye relief with poer i would say that 7 is to much for deer hunting.

[beersunny]

i agree nikon is a great scope for the $.

[EagleEyeJack]

Congrats on the new rifle!!

Is it a Ruger M77 Hawkeye Frontier Rifle?

If it is, there are 2 locations that you can mount the scope on that rifle. Since it is a 25-06, I would use the rear scope location and a standard rifle scope.

If you use the forward scope position, a handgun scope should work in that location. They have the higher eye relief.

I like Burris scopes but there are many other good ones.

[Roosterslayer]

all i shoot is Nikon as well, and i picked up a Nikon prostaff 3X9X40 for my wife and her 243. she loves it! great glass, and very clear!

[deadeye]

Grute, here is some good reading on selecting a scope. 
http://www.opticsplanet.net/how-to-choose-riflescope.html

[EagleEyeJack]

I was thumbing through the manual and it said to get a scope with a 7-15 eye relief. 

This is the M77 Mk II FRONTIER rifle that the manual is refering to, it needs the 7-15 eye relief because of the scope location. That is why a handgun scope would work. If you do not have this type of rifle, then a standard rifle scope will work.

[Grute Man]

Im pretty sure its the Fontier but it doesn't say that anywhere on the gun and has different furniture that the picture you showed there EagleEye.  I did see a hand gun scope with that high eye relief but didn't know if that would work or not.

Also, I think there is only one mounting location so it looks like I have to go with that high eye relief or my kid might get socked in the eye on his first shot.

Thanks for the help.  Im gonna check into all this and anything eles someone finds out is greatly appreciated.

GRUTE   

[Grute Man]

Grute,,,

check out he Zeiss scopes they have on that is in the 280 dollar range that is a very nice scope for a first timer.

            When I Googled "Zeiss Scope", the 2nd selection from Google said "Grute,,, check out he Zeiss scopes they have on that is..."           

Does this mean we're spending too much time on line?         

[Cody Gruchow]

lol thats to funny, still voting NIKON #1

[Grute Man]

Well I searched endlessly -- no wait! I did find an end - I hope.  I found the Bushnell Banner Dusk & Dawn with a 6" eye relief.  The manual says a 7" relief due to high recoil but I think that's for other calibers.  This is a 25.06 so I think one inch less on eye relief will be ok.

What do you guys think?  I don't know much about scopes.

Grute 

[Cody Gruchow]

well it aint a nikon but bushnells are also nice scopes.

[Grute Man]

I looked at the Nikons and Leupolds and BSA and  and    and I just had a hard time finding one with the eye relief that the manula says is needed. 

OOFDA!  I just hope the gun shop has it or can get it.

[EagleEyeJack]

The manual says a 7" relief due to high recoil but I think that's for other calibers. 

It is not because of recoil that it states that eye relief, it has nothing to do with the recoil at all. It is because of the location of the scope on the gun. Everything that I have seen for that rifle, if it is a FRONTIER only, shows that there are two places to mount a scope. One in the rear/normal location and another in a forward location. Can you take a picture of the gun and post it?

The picture that I posted shows the scope in the forward position. One can see the place where the rings go for the rear/normal location in that picture also, next to the bolt is where the Ruger rings go.

[tripnchip]

Thout I could see a mounting area further back in that pic. But I agree you would have to go to a pistol scope to get that ey relief.

[EagleEyeJack]

These articles helps explain the Ruger M77 Mk II Frontier

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/long_guns/m77_121405/

http://www.shootingtimes.com/longgun_reviews/77_062405/

Burris has a Scout Scope 2.75X with an eye relief of 8.5"-14"

http://www.burrisoptics.com/special1.html#2x


I do not see the Ruger M77 Mk II Frontier offered in 25-06. I am thinking that you do not have the Frontier. Maybe?

[Grute Man]

Thanks EagleEye. I will get some pictures but for tonight - Im bushed.  I'll get them on here tomorrow and I'll also check out your links.

Thanks again.

Grute

[Benny]

Hey Grute, EagleEye has  pretty good ifo on the scope and why they are saying the 7- to 15 inch eye relief.

The "scout"scopes came about a few years back when people started seeing them on Military sniper and spec ops rifles and also on some older military rifles that were sporsterized and had no scope mounts on the recievers that were to hard to drill into.

The "scout" scopes are not new either, but not widely used till as of late.

I would recamend using reciver scope mounts(rear position) and go with a decent scope you can aford.

The Bushnel you liked is a good scope, as are the Nikons and other high end scopes named here.
But for Minnesota whitetail your average distance of shot is going to be under 100 yards, even in open country.

Clarity,anti fog, and light gathering ability are what will make a good scope, the cheaper ones like a Bushnel sports view, the cheap Nikon,and low end BSA's are going to sacrafice something to get you a cheap price.

A decent scope will run about $125 to $225 in most cases and higher as you look at the higher end scopes.

Power wise a 3 X 9 X 40 scope is all you realy need, a larger diamiter scope like a 50 or a 75 will give you more light gathering ability and a wider field of view.

The scopes over 14 power will have an adjustable objective ring, this is to clarify the target when set on the high limits.

As for standard eye relief the 7 inch range is good, 5 inches is getting to close to your face and you could end up with scope eye

If you get to long of eye relief you will have to streach your self back away from the scope to see correctly.

When you mount the scope leave every thing loose accept the base that mounts to the rifle its self.That isn't adjustable so tighten it to the specs called out, and don't be shy to use a dab of  removable locktite!

Shoulder the gun and aim it so you are comfortable with where your cheak is at on the stock.
Have some one move the scope back and forth in the rings till you can see the whole field of view or in other words the whole circle!

Make sure the gun is squared and the cross hairs are squared up as well then snug up the screws .
If your going to bore sight it then your ready for that, if your just going to shoot it at paper then now your going to want to tighten up the screws to factory specs.

Start out at 25 yards till you know where the bullet is hitting, then move out to 100 yards.
Don't try shooting more than 25 yards till you know it's on target or you will be chasing the flyers all day.

You also might want to wait for a calm day and let the barrel cool a little between rounds.
Get to the range before late fall when every one else is doing last minute sight ins as well.

Many ranges won't let you wait for the barrel to cool between rounds if they have a line waiting for a bench at rifle sight in in the fall.

Good luck, Benny

[EagleEyeJack]

As for standard eye relief the 7 inch range is good, 5 inches is getting to close to your face and you could end up with scope eye

I have never been hit with my scope. The most eye relief that I have is 3.7"-4.7" on my Leupold VX-II 3-9x40mm mounted on my 338 Win Mag. I also shoot a 30-06 & 270 with even less eye relief and have no problems what so ever. I guess that I do not understand what people are doing to end up getting scoped. Anyway, best of luck with your son's rifle. I think that you have enough info to get it set the way you want it. 

[Grute Man]

Sorry I didn't post these sooner.  I'll ask the guy at the gun shop if he can mount it differently but in the first photo, you'll see where they have the mounting plates.





WOW Oober Poneage looks tough, hey?         Maybe he's mad that I can't figure this thing out.   

Later
Grute 

[Benny]

Grute, those mounts look like they are in the correct location for a standard scoe mount.
A scout scope mount system would be a lot further to toward the barrel or on the barrel.

Buy the scope you like and get a good set of mounts to fit it and go to twon.
The eye relief will fall with in a close enough range for the average shooter any way!

Beny

[Grute Man]

Sounds good.   Thanks.   

[Roosterslayer]

Don have you picked out a scope yet?

[Grute Man]

Yep.  We sure did.  Thanks for asking; I forgot to post it here.  We got a Leuopold but darned if I can remember what modle number it was. 

Im not sure if we got the eye relief that the manual was talking about but I shot it a couple of weekends ago and it shoots great.  Too bad the little guy who won the gun isn't ready for it.  Kinda big and loud for him at this point but he's got some growin to do.  He told me that if he's not hunting with it, he'd let me use it cause my only other rifle is my Remington 870.  Those slugs kick like a mule!!

[cva54]

look at burris you can get a dam good scope for a good price go to bust buy optics NOT best buy

[Grute Man]

Oh thanks for the tip but we already got one.  This was back in the summer when I was looking for the scope.  The owner's manual said it had to have this HUGE eye relief so I was going crazy trying to find a scope with a 7.5" eye relief. Well they're hard to find and I just talked to some guys at the gun shop and they fixed us up wiht a nice Leupold.  That thing is really nice.  I look through the one on my 870 and its like an old black and white TV compared to this Leupold which is more like todays plazma screens. 

[Cody Gruchow]

you cant get much better than a leupold scope. did that cost you a pretty penny? im getting a new scope for the slug gun a nikon slughunter and thats 245 so i imagine you paid that or more right?

[Grute Man]

Yeah it was around $300 - $350.  It's pretty darn nice by my standards.  The next time we get up to the rifle range, we're going to try to hit the 400 yard range.