DDS

[wildlifeminnesota]

What is this 

NO TEAM MEMBER MAY HAVE MORE THAN 2 SPECIES AS THE TOP FISH FOR THEIR TEAM. THIS IS A TEAM EVENT SO THE OTHER TWO MEMBERS WILL BE RESPONSIBLE TO SCORE THE 3RD SPECIES.   THIS IS A NEW RULE FOR THIS YEAR****

You of all people on here should know that, there are some that have some sort of family crises, or just can not get out do to bad ice,

This is a rule change that you should have been posted before add the sign up. 

[wildlifeminnesota]

If the rule was on the open water challenge we would be losing Why Because one of are team has all three, Not to said you or are other team mates is not trying, But the fact is that how it would be, Now do not get me wrong I am all for team work.

last year my team mate posted two fish then was upgraded by one of his team mates, So it not that other are not trying to play.  

[Stnmtz]

You scared wildlife i personally like the rule thats why there are 3 man teams one person can still be carried be the other two

[wildlifeminnesota]

You scared wildlife i personally like the rule thats why there are 3 man teams one person can still be carried be the other two

No I NOT scared!!!  The point that DDS is want teams to work together But I see that most of the team are. and add new rules is just like government, The more rules you add the less the fun it is, 

 

[DDSBYDAY]

  I'm sure it will be fine.  It has been discussed for the open water challenge too.  We can see how it works out here and then decide if changes need to be made for next summer or not.  All it does is open up the challenge to better team work.

[dakids]

I like the change a lot.  Wildlife it is pretty obvious that you are one of if not THE BEST FISHERMAN on the site. Winning is great fun for you and not so much for the rest.  It sucks when you are getting crushed and have no shot at winning. 

[wildlifeminnesota]

I like the change a lot.  Wildlife it is pretty obvious that you are one of if not THE BEST FISHERMAN on the site. Winning is great fun for you and not so much for the rest.  It sucks when you are getting crushed and have no shot at winning. 

Thank you dakids For your honesty, 

Is That how some of you all feel? Be honest here,
Would more of you sign up in the challenge if you had more of a chance?

[Fawkinnae]

I think it is an excellent rule change and I would like to see us consider possibly all three members of the team being required to enter a fish. There are some advantages though to this intermediate step. What I like about the rule is that let's say a professional fisherman who might be on the water 120 days out of the year doesn't have an huge advantage and can still feel like he can participate in the competition.

[Lee Borgersen]

I think it is an excellent rule change and I would like to see us consider possibly all three members of the team being required to enter a fish. There are some advantages though to this intermediate step. What I like about the rule is that let's say a professional fisherman who might be on the water 120 days out of the year doesn't have an huge advantage and can still feel like he can participate in the competition.

I'd like to take a moment here to address the previous assumption. "What I like about the rule is that let's say a professional fisherman who might be on the water 120 days out of the year doesn't have a huge advantage"

Just to set the record straight assuming that I fall into the category of the fore mentioned "professional fisherman."

I have a problem with the assumption that I have a huge advantage by being on the water more than some others. The reason being that it could realistically be considered a disadvantage. You see when I'm on the water with clients I'm trying to put people on fish and not out there fishing for LEE'S Fishing Challenge Status . Therefore, I am on the water more than most others but in many cases never cast a line all day.

If the fishing becomes tuff I'll throw a line in to try to work up some action. Upon a hook set I'll immediately hand my rod off to a client so they may have the fun of catching the fish. So, what I'm saying here is that my assumed huge advantage time on the water is inaccurate. If I wasn't guiding I would have plenty more time to fish for Lee!

My personal fishing time is when I'm on vacation!

[The General]

Lee I think your reading to much into what Fawk said 

[Lee Borgersen]

Lee I think your reading to much into what Fawk said  

  I was just posting my opinion in regard to this statement:
  "What I like about the rule is that let's say a professional fisherman who might be on the water 120 days out of the year doesn't have a huge advantage"
 
If I've tried to be to detailed and specific in my post I apologize. My intent was not to overwhelm anyone with a straight up common sense reply.

Now in your own words please explain what "have a huge advantage" means so I can tap into your infinite wisdom for comfort.

[DDSBYDAY]

    I think we are getting off track.  The rule change is just to open up the competion and get more competitors involved.  It also will increase teamwork because there will now need to be some strategy as to what fish to post.  If you look at last years ice challenge the winning team had 2 fish posted by 1 member and the 3rd fish posted by a 2nd member.  The rule change would have made no difference in their winning. 

    If my team is in need a fish and I can't post another I will simply try to get together and see if we can't go get that fish.  Teams that work together will have no problems.

[wildlifeminnesota]

    I think we are getting off track.  The rule change is just to open up the competion and get more competitors involved.  It also will increase teamwork because there will now need to be some strategy as to what fish to post.  If you look at last years ice challenge the winning team had 2 fish posted by 1 member and the 3rd fish posted by a 2nd member.  The rule change would have made no difference in their winning. 

    If my team is in need a fish and I can't post another I will simply try to get together and see if we can't go get that fish.  Teams that work together will have no problems.

and team that get no  will have no change of winning, Because they can't pick the slack, case in point you last year in the open water you had no one but you to post a fish 

I know how that feel been there done that  You are not going to get all of your team to  like Fawkinnae said that a fact.

I under stand what you trying to do, But it not going to work,  But then what do I know, you will find out, 

Now I will say this one time If this case happen again to me I will just not sign up, Because I will feel what the point, 

all so I will hold my fish to fine out what my team mates will do, all you will do is have less fish posted in tell the end, I am just being honest here, I  have no  huge advantage then anyone else, I am not professional fisherman not that this make a deference, I fish most of the time by myself,

But then you guys can and will do what you want,  and I will diced if I will sign in or not next time,

This is just how I feel 

 dakids said not so much for the rest.  It sucks when you are getting crushed and have no shot at winning.
dakids I have been there and this is why it call a FISHING CHALLENGE I have lean to make my changes in how I fish and what I go after and what time of year I lean to do my home work and put the time in, I do go out and come back with nothing to show at time but I just keep going back a trying it again,

With this new rule I feel that it will not be a Challenge it will be all of the luck if you get good people on your team, that will fish or not That no challenge that will be no team work, You will see,
 Again this is how I feel and you can take it or not, 

I will all add that this will not make judges this any easier,     
 

[glenn57]

so........i've followed this thread and will add my 2 bits as if it matters. i get both arguments. and my sense reading the happenings in these challenges is at times that because wild has had great success people feel they dont have a chance.............maybe?? but i look at it as someone to knock off......a challenge!!! i actually hope i dont get drawn on his team so i can shoot for him. not to mention the mutilude of lakes he gets to pick.

as far as the new rule, i kinda like it for the more team involvement aspect, but like wild stated some dont help. in my case i have had fish to post but one on my team outdid me! sure i could of posted it to be eligible for prizes and there nice.........its still for FUN!!!! KEY WORD THERE.

another angle is some people are better at fishing different species then others. for me i feel the ice challenge is harder. i am and avid spear chucker so my chance of a slimer not speared to enter is slim to none. i dont tipup fish much. matter of fact last year when i entered that nord i was standing next to my buddy 'ing when his flag went up and i got to pull it in. and ole marble eyes i dont fish them much thru the ice or open water, but these challenges has had me focus on walleyes more in hope of getting and old down on his luck eye. if i'd enter a bass it would have been caught accidently fishing for nords or sunfish!

well instead of all this babblin i'd like to say in conclussion this should remain something thats fun and from my point of view, not taken too seriously.   

[Lee Borgersen]

How do I describe this without using the word discrimination since I think that word is over used in todays society. Let's use the term selective harvest instead.

So the way I see it is we would be discriminating selectively harvesting specifically the most active posters in the fishing challenge. In essence by placing handcuffs on them so they won't over preform and bring their team closer to the top.

To use another analogy lets implement this same scenario in other team sports.

#1.
This batter has already got a double and a homer and were still down by one run. Well, then lets put in a pinch hitter in for him. This way someone else on the team has a chance to win the game I hope.


#2.
We've got 2 field goals from our punter so far and one more and we win. It's a 53 yard attempt. Hey coach I've got a great Idea! Lets give someone else on the team a chance to kick it so we look like a better rounded team this year.

#3.
Were up by one goal to nothing. If we can just hang on for 2 more minutes were in the playoffs. Very true but, our third string goalie needs some chance to play and we agreed before the season that everyone gets his fair share. So pull our current goalie. If we loose next season is only a year away.

#4.

We're in third place in the MNO Fishing Challenge thanks to the two nice fish Frank entered. Frank thinks well I'm done for the rest of the contest having entered two good fish. Where are my team mates. I never see them on smackdown thread either. I checked on their profiles and found one of them hasn't made a current post since he signed up for the challenge. The other one only posts on the hunting forums at times. When I sent him a PM he stated he hasn't had a chance to get out fishing this year but plans to buy a boat next year.

[glenn57]

but as DDS posted in an earlier response, lookin at last years winner this supposed new rule would of had no affect on the outcome.  the fish species in the ice challenge are nords walleyes and panfish correct? bass are no longer a qualifier. and quite frankly the actice fisherman in the ice challenge usually score there big scores with the eyes and nords where the biggest changes take place. the panfish category does matter but not to the extent the other 2 species do.

i can play either way.......no matter to me. personally i'd hate to see these challenges go away for the lack of participation because the guys that are in charge of it try a new twist on an experimental basis. 

[wildlifeminnesota]

look at the hunting challenge, I did not sign up, DDS did not, General did not, Why is that? for me it was the lack of a challenge I shoot me deer I am done if my team mates do not go out because it's raining no chance of winning for me.

To me you can not call it a challenge if you put handcuffs on teams, That is what this will do,

Thanks glenn57  I am sure glad that I am a challenge to you,  I had the same thou when I see Lee at the top all the time,   

[Lee Borgersen]

Glen and others,

My concerns are directed specifically towards the MNO open water challenge. I should have stated that right off (My Bad) . The future of the open water challenge was mentioned so that's what I've been trying to address. I was impressed with the planning/expertise of the thought process involved with the open water challenge. Therefore I've always felt "If it isn't broken don't fix it.

The Ice challenge is relatively new and is being reviewed by it's creator with all best intentions. I don't ice fish any longer so I'm not trying to address it's by-laws or direct it.

[wildlifeminnesota]

glenn57  the panfish category does matter but not to the extent the other 2 species do.

Not true last year's Ice challenge was won by the pan fish and less the 1/2 inch go back and look I am the one that post it. 

[glenn57]

Glen and others,

My concerns are directed specifically towards the MNO open water challenge. I should have stated that right off (My Bad) . The future of the open water challenge was mentioned so that's what I've been trying to address. I was impressed with the planning/expertise of the thought process involved. Therefore I've always felt "If it isn't broken don't fix it.

The Ice challenge is relatively new and is being reviewed by it's creator with all best intentions. I don't ice fish any longer so I'm not trying to address it's by-laws or direct it.

Lee, your forgiven!!!!!

[Outdoors Junkie]

Change is always hard!

Let's remain open minded to this rule change. At the end of this years challenge we can get feedback from all participants and decide if we want to keep it or go back to the previous rule.

I can see both sides of this discussion. I have signed up for almost all the past open and hard water fishing challenges. In a couple of the more recent challenges I am guilty of being someone who doesn't post a fish. With the new rule I can see this upcoming challenge making me more active. The competitive teams will stay in contact with their teammates and encourage them to get out more or maybe even plan a day out on the lake. If I were lucky enough to end up on the same team as a member like WildlifeMN, Lee, DDS or other past challenge winners, I would hope they would share some tips with me to make me a better fisherman.

Maybe this is just wishful thinking, but I envision logging on to the site and having more personal messages or a phone call from my fishing challenge teammates encouraging me to get out and help us land the fish we need to win. If we needed a certain species, I could talk strategies on how to land that monster on a lake by me. I would be more motivated to get out there because my team needs me and I don't want to let them down.

With the past challenges I am often thinking the leaders in the challenge are "Fishing Gods" and why should I bother? I am a novice and don't have the knowledge or experience that they do. I could never catch them. With this new rule, maybe I can become a better fisherman with the help of my team.

Again, if it doesn't work out, we can always go back to the way it was before.

[glenn57]

glenn57  the panfish category does matter but not to the extent the other 2 species do.

Not true last year's Ice challenge was won by the pan fish and less the 1/2 inch go back and look I am the one that post it. 

i disagree...............what if that nord was a 1/2 inch shorter andthe eye 1/4 inch shorter

[Bobby Bass]

If you want to make a rule change that will make a difference and effect the outcomes of the Challenges I suggest you remove the drawing and allow teams to sign up. This would result in several subtle changes to the Challenges. You would have three fishermen who want to fish together. You would allow groups of friends or relatives to enter. You would have a very good chance of increasing membership because you would be bring in new friends of members. The only penalty that I would impose is that the winning team can not return the following year, meaning that team can only win once and be out. They would then be forced to find different teammates. Ice challenge could be reduced to two member teams.

The original idea of the Challenge was to introduce new fishermen to each other by randomly putting them together, that was also several years ago and you now have a pretty hard-core base of fishermen here that know each other, time for another twist. I don't like the current suggested rule as I think it is pointed at Wild.  Guess you could call it the Wild Factor, Just a thought on how to shake things up with out changing a basic rule of the challenge. 

[glenn57]

 i know i'm pointed at wild............to some day kick his   !!!!!!!

and what outdoors junkie said!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lee Borgersen]

                      2013 Open Water Fishing Challenge Blues

I've already posted my two best fish for the year and here I sit waiting for the 2014 Challenge so I may be allowed to participate once again. The smackdown thread is no longer fun since I have nothing left to smack about being handcuffed and all. Borgie is upset watching me mope around the house because The Challenge is already over for me.

[Outdoors Junkie]

look at the hunting challenge, I did not sign up, DDS did not, General did not, Why is that? for me it was the lack of a challenge I shoot me deer I am done if my team mates do not go out because it's raining no chance of winning for me.

To me you can not call it a challenge if you put handcuffs on teams, That is what this will do,

Thanks glenn57  I am sure glad that I am a challenge to you,  I had the same thou when I see Lee at the top all the time,   

Disclaimer: I am not targeting Wildlifeminnesota or anyone else with my reply. I was a little hurt that their are activie members out there that don't want to participate in the current deer hunting challenge because of bad experiences from the past.

Then this just popped in to my head...

We all should look at these challenges as an opportunity to get to know a couple members on the MNO site better and have a lot of fun doing it! Yes, winning is nice, but it's not the only thing. Making friendships that last past the hunting/fishing season is much better!

How can we make our teammates better? Exchange contact info, talk strategies, share the success and failures of each hunt or fishing trip.

Make the challenge more then just about I got stuck with these two other guys who didn't do anything. I encourage our participants to help make your teammates better. We can interact more then...hey I guess we are paired up, what should our team name be?

I would love to see everyone still be a part of the 2012 deer hunting challenge!

Everyone still has time to sign up before the 2nd draft round (before Oct 27th). Here is a link to the sign up page. http://mnoutdoorsman.com/forums/index.php?topic=27090.45

The only people who don't have a chance at winning is those that don't sign up to participate.

At the end of the deer hunting challenge let's ask for feedback and make it better.

 

[glenn57]

call me a doofus, but its my assumption that if you sign up for this your going to partcipate in the sport/event. by that i mean if you sign up for deer hunt your gonna hunt ete etc.

but then ya'all know what assume can mean!!

[Outdoors Junkie]

call me a doofus, but its my assumption that if you sign up for this your going to partcipate in the sport/event. by that i mean if you sign up for deer hunt your gonna hunt ete etc.

but then ya'all know what assume can mean!!

I am not positive what you are asking here?
If someone doesn't hunt deer,they are not encouraged to sign up for the Deer hunting challenge. If someone doesn't fish, the are not encouraged to sign up for the fishing challenge.

Unless they want to get out and try hunting or fishing this year.

[DDSBYDAY]

   I didn't sign up for the deer contest because I will be fishing and  shooting ducks until everything is froze up.   

[wildlifeminnesota]

i know i'm pointed at wild............to some day kick his   !!!!!!!

and what outdoors junkie said!!!!!!!!!!!!

I know your not!!!