Getting prepared

[Big Slick]

I have had a few dogs in my years, mostly farm dogs, that were by some sorts good hunters. I am going to be getting another dog sometime in the near future but could really use a good book or something as to prepare Me as on how to train the new pooch before I get it.
  Also would like advise on the non-barking collars and other training equipment that is available such as collars, bird dummies, whistles...You get the idea. I have never trained a dog before, either they had it or they didn't. This one will be given some time.

[vickieschessies]

Richard Wolters has the best dog training books

[Grute Man]

I know this would be a haul for you but I took my dogs to TR for Dogs in Hugo.  They did a great job with the basic obedience classes and have good advise on all the other stuff.  For hunting, you'll need to take em somewheres else.  I think the owner is a former police officer so no funny business!! 

[Big Slick]

Richard Wolters has the best dog training books

Thanks, I will absolutely check it out. I want a good dog not a lazy hound.
I also know that it starts with me.



Grute Man, for some reason I feel I have to do this myself...Don't know why.

[Grouseman]

Wolters has some ok points in his training methods, but I caution you. As a gun dog trainer I've had to fix many problem dogs with people who used Wolters methods. The reason is he puts training in a time frame. For example when he writes that at 5 months old a pup should know A-G, at 7 months old a dog should know H-M etc. Well not all dogs learn at the same rate, so when a dog/pup is a slow maturing dog it will learn at a slower rate. So the person who has this dog pushes it in it's training trying to keep up to the training methods and ends up making more problems for himself and the pup. Many of these problem cannot be fixed. I would instead go to J Robinsons book "Training the Retriever", and James Lamb Free, Retriever Training. Tapes and DVD's by Mike Lardy are also worth the investment. As for Obedience classes through a local community ed class, they're ok, not great, but if you have nothing else, it's a start. Most "obedience" trainers teach only ob, and don't give much help for the gun dog, but still it's a start in the right direction.

[vickieschessies]

Grouseman true but if people want to do this on their own these are the best books to learn a few things no one person has all the answers and these book are only meant to take away food for thought. These methods are not set in stone,  we learn all the time even from our dogs I know 1 thing I have learned alot in the last 24yrs

[Grouseman]

I totally agree about doing it on their own. I'm simply pointing out the problems I've seen as a professional trainer for the past 28 yrs when people have used methods that put training in a time frame. To each their own. If a method works for one person or dog then great. I'm trying to help avoid problems. As a trainer(I) and a host of other very good trainers end up trying to fix these man made problems which are caused by pushing a young dog too fast. I've got 2 training dogs in the kennel now that fit this very same scenario. One GSP and the other a GWP, both on the time frame method, and both dogs basket cases, because the owners pushed them too fast trying to keep up with how the book is written. There are too many good books and DVD's/video's available that teach proven methods. Yes w/o question people can cause problems for the pup/ dog through any method, the time frame approach seems to be the one that keeps causing most of the problems.

[thunderpout]

I agree the wolters books are very good.  I also agree that he pushes the time frame too much.  But remember that gundog was written in about the 1950's....at the time the book was a revalation in pointing dog training.  It did make me push my first english setter too fast thru some areas of training, and may have taken some "fun and joy" out of it for him, and I now just pace the time frame aspect of his books.  Dogs , like people, learn at different speeds and levels.  I have to add that the setter I mentioned ended up being a great foot hunting dog and for being ones first trained bird dog, He surely would be one of my favorite dogs and huntin buddies if he were still alive today.  And I give the late Richard Wolters alot of credit for Dukes sucesses and fun I had hunting with him..... ::cheers::     -thunderpout 8)

[thunderpout]

Wolters also wrote (besides gun dog) Game dog , Family dog and I belive water dog.  Ive heard good things about all of em.  Another I read but cant remember the authors name is "How to train gundogs to train themselves".....      -thunderpout 8)

[JackpineRob]

The biggest thing I took out of the Wolters books was the order of training.  Teach this and that - once that's down pat work onwards to the next thing.  I got a calendar without the dates and months on it (blank calendar thingie) and marked down as we reached each stage. 

Once a stage was reached, it was marked down, and we went on to the next thing.  I didn't take his "this is what you need to do by X week" as gospel.  Of course, we were working off of Game Dog, which I think is his best book for your average guy.

When my (then) pup was 18 months old, we traveled down to Game Fair to see how the real dogs worked.  The heat was horrible.  I had no air in the old station wagon.  After a quick tour through the dog stations, we headed for a tree near the lake where they were doing water retrieves.  Many of the dogs refused to go, and I had talked to the guy running that deal and told him my boy would be pleased to get the lost dummies.  Each time he was needed, he would take a running start down the hill, use the dock for extra loft, and launch himself into the water.

I was in no hurry to get back to the station wagon and roast all the way home, so we were there for quite a while.  After a bit of time had passed, an older gentleman came and sat down next to me, and mentioned that there was some interest being expressed about whether my dog was for sale. 

We chatted a bit, and when I finally looked at him squarely, I darn near choked.  It was Richard Wolters.  His dog was laying on the other side of him, and by gosh if it wasn't Tar, the star of Game Dog.

He eventually left, telling me he had a class to teach - and then told me to stay in the shade and keep my boy cool.    I was approached afterwards by a couple of very nice fellows who were interested in taking my dog home - but seeing as he had been a wedding present from Mrs. Jackpine I wasn't entertaining any offers.

We met again several years later, and he was generous with both time and advice.  I was working a new pup, and had to smile when he suggested gently that sometimes an owner had to enforce the "no" command (the pup was being more than a handful).

The Wolters method is an excellent starting point for someone figuring out how to do things without a lot of professional help.  Keep the order of training in mind, keep your temper in check, and concentrate on thinking through the various training issues.  Whether you're using Game Dog, Water Dog, or Training Your Retriever by James Lamb Free, the methods and techniques don't always work out like the books say.  There are times when you simply need to back off for a few days or even a week. 

If you're the type who demands instant foolproof results, or you know you don't have the patience to spend the time with the dog,  there are pros who work with something called force training.   I've seen some fine working dogs come out of such training.