Tribal Netting

[spear foot 1]

 Ya I watched the video of the fish cleaning, Ya they come from other states to net and how much do they spend when they are here? I know what it cost me to go hunting and fishing in other states with license,food,rooms,gas,and so on I better quit talking about this other wise it brings me down. Worry about our selves right.

[thunderpout]

I can understand most of the different arguements on this issue... what side you take is a personal thing I guess... the one that always puzzles me is the "they should be using candles on the bows of their birch bark canoes using barbed saplings for spears...etc."  take on things.... well the guys sayin this go out and use their Aqua-vue cameras, GPS's & locators/depthfinders using boron/high modulous carbon graphite rods with billet alloy, 100 ballbearing reels, and enzyme infused high tech artificial baits in their $10-20,000 "fishing boats"... I think we need to look at ourselves in the mirror a little.    The situation is a mess to say the least & there is really not an easy way to satisfy everyones wants on this .... not unlike abortion, gun rights etc.  I guess it doesnt hurt to vent... but, white people have screwed up our resources in soooo many ways thru the years.... nobody on this planet has a right to abuse what we have, and as a whole, look what we do to it all.... I guess what Im sayin is people who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks....

[Randy Kaar]

As a non native, I have to abide by the laws.. If the natives were to use
the thousands and thousands of pounds of fish that they are entitled to
for personal use, I have no problem with that. But they dont.. We all
remember the net issue on mille lacs with the lost nets, Did anyone get
into trouble for that? If anyone did, we sure wouldnt hear about it...
I really dont think selling fish was part of the treaty 200 years ago, Time
to reduce their limit to personal use only..

randy

[spear foot 1]

Then what! Casinos were suppose to help with the native economy but that isn't helping enough they say so take away their sales of fish and then what. All that is going to do is make it worse so I guess leave well enough alone. Look on the brite side at least we can vent on here as long as we behave.

[thunderpout]

That point there is where I have an issue also.... That to me is just plain ole greed... taking more than what you personally will use.... thats kinda like the white man killing all the Buffalo and leaving them to rot.... but then again, who is it that buys all those pounds of walleye and eats them... its us!  We are the market that they sell to.... think about that when youre at a resturant next time, sucking down a nice big plate sized walleye fillet.  200 years ago people werent eating walleye in a Red Lobster or at a VFW all you can eat fish fry on a friday night or picking some up at Morey's fish house or at Rainbow on sale...

[Tyler Rother]

Good point thunder - thats why the only fish I buy/order is halibut because i cant afford going and catching my own. Here it is, boycott Walleye, I know were a small group, but it will affect them if we spread the word. Catch your own, isnt that hard :)

[beeker]

well I'm glad I didn't ever have to gas any of you guys that waved signs with bud as I was the m33 operator for my guard unit that was put on alert 2 years in a row in case there was "civil unrest".

as far as the indians go (not native americans) they have the right if they don't care there really isn't anything you can do except don't go to the casino's and don't buy their fish.

[Randy Kaar]

Good point Beeker, then when they cant get any money from the casinos
or from selling their fish... Govt bailout!
We will end up paying for it one way or another...

randy

[The General]

I stand behind the Indians rights to net and gather. BUT! not with white man monofilament gill nets and million candle power spotlights and big lund boats. With generators in tents to heat and clean the catch with electric knives. If they wish to net They should be able to do all they want with traditional hand woven nets and candles on a stick with a clamshell as a reflector. Wadeing in the water with spears is fine with me too. The resource cannot take overharvest. Native people realize overharvest I think it is just a get back at whitey thing.

I was more or less kicked out of My American Indian studies class at a University for saying pretty much this exact quote.  However I didn't say the last 2 sentences..........but I was thinking it. 

[7outof10]

I stand behind the Indians rights to net and gather. BUT! not with white man monofilament gill nets and million candle power spotlights and big lund boats. With generators in tents to heat and clean the catch with electric knives. If they wish to net They should be able to do all they want with traditional hand woven nets and candles on a stick with a clamshell as a reflector. Wadeing in the water with spears is fine with me too. The resource cannot take overharvest. Native people realize overharvest I think it is just a get back at whitey thing.

I was more or less kicked out of My American Indian studies class at a University for saying pretty much this exact quote.  However I didn't say the last 2 sentences..........but I was thinking it. 

so we all have talked about it now we need to have steep 2 .....what can we do to stop it if any thing ? should we march together lol ........what can we do about it there has to be something

[beeker]

nope there really isn't anything you can do. the indians view this right like we view our right to own guns. it sucks but it's a great big turd sandwich that our forfathers made and now we all get to take a bite

[kenhuntin]

I can understand most of the different arguements on this issue... what side you take is a personal thing I guess... the one that always puzzles me is the "they should be using candles on the bows of their birch bark canoes using barbed saplings for spears...etc."  take on things.... well the guys sayin this go out and use their Aqua-vue cameras, GPS's & locators/depthfinders using boron/high modulous carbon graphite rods with billet alloy, 100 ballbearing reels, and enzyme infused high tech artificial baits in their $10-20,000 "fishing boats"... I think we need to look at ourselves in the mirror a little.    The situation is a mess to say the least & there is really not an easy way to satisfy everyones wants on this .... not unlike abortion, gun rights etc.  I guess it doesnt hurt to vent... but, white people have screwed up our resources in soooo many ways thru the years.... nobody on this planet has a right to abuse what we have, and as a whole, look what we do to it all.... I guess what Im sayin is people who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks....

C'mon Thunder The guys in the $20-30m walleye boats are at least practicing catch and release.They spend alot of dollars on equipment and licenses in hopes of pulling up a 30 incher that will probably be replicated in a graphite mount. I used to run the Red Lake Res. pretty regulaly in the mid eighties I pulled over by one of the roadside dumpsters for a leg stretch and witnessed two garbage cans full of uncleaned net scarred rotting walleyes. They must have been too heavy to lift into the burn pile. Or whoever took them from the lake was too busy to clean them. There is no comparison to netting and the use of electronics on gamefish.

[Mayfly]

C'mon Thunder The guys in the $20-30m walleye boats are at least practicing catch and release.They spend alot of dollars on equipment and licenses in hopes of pulling up a 30 incher that will probably be replicated in a graphite mount. I used to run the Red Lake Res. pretty regulaly in the mid eighties I pulled over by one of the roadside dumpsters for a leg stretch and witnessed two garbage cans full of uncleaned net scarred rotting walleyes. They must have been too heavy to lift into the burn pile. Or whoever took them from the lake was too busy to clean them. There is no comparison to netting and the use of electronics on gamefish.

Very good points. Thunder almost had me sold....almost. Doesn't compare in the least bit.

[KTapper]

Ha I just got an email from my college Mankato State, saying there are new classes that they are offering the classes are as follows: AIS 230: American Indians of Minnesota, AIS 340: American Indians in Film, and AIS 380: The Sacred Landscape.

[7outof10]

I can understand most of the different arguements on this issue... what side you take is a personal thing I guess... the one that always puzzles me is the "they should be using candles on the bows of their birch bark canoes using barbed saplings for spears...etc."  take on things.... well the guys sayin this go out and use their Aqua-vue cameras, GPS's & locators/depthfinders using boron/high modulous carbon graphite rods with billet alloy, 100 ballbearing reels, and enzyme infused high tech artificial baits in their $10-20,000 "fishing boats"... I think we need to look at ourselves in the mirror a little.    The situation is a mess to say the least & there is really not an easy way to satisfy everyones wants on this .... not unlike abortion, gun rights etc.  I guess it doesnt hurt to vent... but, white people have screwed up our resources in soooo many ways thru the years.... nobody on this planet has a right to abuse what we have, and as a whole, look what we do to it all.... I guess what Im sayin is people who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks....

C'mon Thunder The guys in the $20-30m walleye boats are at least practicing catch and release.They spend alot of dollars on equipment and licenses in hopes of pulling up a 30 incher that will probably be replicated in a graphite mount. I used to run the Red Lake Res. pretty regulaly in the mid eighties I pulled over by one of the roadside dumpsters for a leg stretch and witnessed two garbage cans full of uncleaned net scarred rotting walleyes. They must have been too heavy to lift into the burn pile. Or whoever took them from the lake was too busy to clean them. There is no comparison to netting and the use of electronics on gamefish.

that is right on

[sandmannd]

C'mon Thunder The guys in the $20-30m walleye boats are at least practicing catch and release.They spend alot of dollars on equipment and licenses in hopes of pulling up a 30 incher that will probably be replicated in a graphite mount. I used to run the Red Lake Res. pretty regulaly in the mid eighties I pulled over by one of the roadside dumpsters for a leg stretch and witnessed two garbage cans full of uncleaned net scarred rotting walleyes. They must have been too heavy to lift into the burn pile. Or whoever took them from the lake was too busy to clean them. There is no comparison to netting and the use of electronics on gamefish.

Very good points. Thunder almost had me sold....almost. Doesn't compare in the least bit.

I understand what Thunder is saying. But at the same time it's quite diferent. I stay in the slot. I personally won't keep a fish over 22" as those are the breeders and most times won't keep over a 20" anywhere. I'll take home a couple of fish for a meal. I won't take home a hundred thousand pounds and then waste it. That's what really makes me sick.

I've been down and watched the comercial netting on the croix a couple of times. They are very careful on how they handle the fish. Especially when they net a game fish, like a walleye, the get them out of the pen as soon as they can. What they don't keep gets released quickly. And they don't use gill nets. Why can't they do the same on ML or Red?

[tmjhamann]

C'mon Thunder The guys in the $20-30m walleye boats are at least practicing catch and release.They spend alot of dollars on equipment and licenses in hopes of pulling up a 30 incher that will probably be replicated in a graphite mount. I used to run the Red Lake Res. pretty regulaly in the mid eighties I pulled over by one of the roadside dumpsters for a leg stretch and witnessed two garbage cans full of uncleaned net scarred rotting walleyes. They must have been too heavy to lift into the burn pile. Or whoever took them from the lake was too busy to clean them. There is no comparison to netting and the use of electronics on gamefish.

Very good points. Thunder almost had me sold....almost. Doesn't compare in the least bit.

I understand what Thunder is saying. But at the same time it's quite diferent. I stay in the slot. I personally won't keep a fish over 22" as those are the breeders and most times won't keep over a 20" anywhere. I'll take home a couple of fish for a meal. I won't take home a hundred thousand pounds and then waste it. That's what really makes me sick.

I've been down and watched the comercial netting on the croix a couple of times. They are very careful on how they handle the fish. Especially when they net a game fish, like a walleye, the get them out of the pen as soon as they can. What they don't keep gets released quickly. And they don't use gill nets. Why can't they do the same on ML or Red?

                     because they have NO respect and wouldn't end up doing jail time for it so why not!

[thunderpout]

Yeah I understand the obvious difference with them keeping and selling all the fish... Im a big catch and release guy... alot of us arent, and if it wasnt for our regs, and if we could take walleyes like the natives,(nets...spearing ect.) we would too, and would be at least as wasteful.... picture what those guys would do that come from out of state that ya always read about comming here and trying to bring a thousand walleyes, perch, whatever... home.  & those are just the ones that get caught!  There are guys that use the tech to fish... then there are people givin the chance, use it to catch and keep every thing they can... I see it all the time ice fishing, you have too... the limit fisherman... fishing out areas till the lakes have those 4" crappies.  Not all the natives keep as many fish as allowed... alot do keep only what they need.  Greed isnt partial to skin color, I guess thats all Im sayin....  Im kind of being the devils advocate here, but I dont think the issues are not as one sided as alot of guys think they are.

[tmjhamann]

what i'm saying is they wantto be treated the same as us than they should have to follow the same regs as us and I don't understand why they can come from other states and take the fish that our tax money paid for .

[thunderpout]

Im sure it has somthing to do with them not having to acknowledge state boundaries... yeah, that doesnt sit well with me either, especially if theyre gonna take walleyes to a different state to sell.  If they were keeping the fish for their consumption it wouldnt be so bad....

[snow]

You guys gotta understand that this operation is commerical and the reservation's has no borders and futher we donot stock walleyes in mille laces and hopefully never will.

Tim

[sandmannd]

Yeah I understand the obvious difference with them keeping and selling all the fish... Im a big catch and release guy... alot of us arent, and if it wasnt for our regs, and if we could take walleyes like the natives,(nets...spearing ect.) we would too, and would be at least as wasteful.... picture what those guys would do that come from out of state that ya always read about comming here and trying to bring a thousand walleyes, perch, whatever... home.  & those are just the ones that get caught!  There are guys that use the tech to fish... then there are people givin the chance, use it to catch and keep every thing they can... I see it all the time ice fishing, you have too... the limit fisherman... fishing out areas till the lakes have those 4" crappies.  Not all the natives keep as many fish as allowed... alot do keep only what they need.  Greed isnt partial to skin color, I guess thats all Im sayin....  Im kind of being the devils advocate here, but I dont think the issues are not as one sided as alot of guys think they are.

I agree that there are many who aren't souly catch and release. I will be the first to say that I fish for meat and I'm not asshamed of that. I have learned over the years the need for CPR and practice that as well. Like I said, I set my own limit and rarely will keep an eye over 20". For who is six eyes not enough for? That should feed a nice sized family just fine. I don't keep limits when I go out either. Sometimes I do, but not always. It comes down to morals. My main thing is that these particular people pride themselves on being part of the land. Then then go out and rape it like this. Just doesn't seem right.

[thunderpout]

Sandman, dont get me wrong... I love to keep some fish to eat too.  We do the same thing I think, you just keep what you are gonna eat... like ya said, you dont fish till ya get your limit, you can fish all day when you C&R!

[sandmannd]

So driving home from the hospital tonight to clean up, I saw the Grand Casino Billboard. It had "Walleye Dinner - May 1-30". Where do you think those eyes are coming from? 

[beeker]

the casinos are the key making the indians change. get the state to pass a bill allowing a state owned casino in downtown st paul (since nothing else is there anymore). have them use the proceeds to cover education so our property taxes are lower. tada problem solved.. now you just need to get pass the indian lobyist machine that own half our reps.

[JohnWester]

So driving home from the hospital tonight to clean up, I saw the Grand Casino Billboard. It had "Walleye Dinner - May 1-30". Where do you think those eyes are coming from? 

at least they are fresh

[JohnWester]

well, sounds like those motherF#$@# lost nets in the ice again this year.  They were even asked not to put nets out until the ice was gone.  Honest to god... what can we do?  Seriously?  I am ready to go out and cut the nets and haul them in, in the middle of the night for cryin out loud.

These ARE pig fishermen.  I hesitate to even call them fishermen.  Can we tip PETA off about them?  Use PETA for our own good?

[GRIZ]

Peta will never do us any good period. Besides would you want to invite a group of radical terrorists to help you out anyway?

I don't see that we can stop it but an idea I have is pretty simple but would never go through. If it really bothers someone they could donate their time to the DNR. All they would do is net walleyes outta their rearing ponds. The walleye would be donated to the tribes to sell/use as they pleased. Well I guess we prolly would have to clean them too. This would accomplish 3 things. One it would clean the eyes outta the rearing ponds that the DNR is to inept to get, thus allowing the pond to be used again much sooner. The tribes would still get their money. Wouldn't need as many fry to plant since they ain't being netted out of those lakes.

I know it sounds hair brained but it would work. Somehow part of this would have to be an agreement or a judge that says that they still can net but only using traditional equipment to carry on their traditions. Personnaly I don't think a traditional net would be set nor a tradional spear thrown.

It would work but the tribes would fight it as what they want is the fun of DOING it but with modern gear.

[snow]

John,

Where did you get this info? Nothing about it happening again on the messanger,news or anything...

Tim

[JohnWester]

heard about it from a guy who called in bear facts & fishtales sunday night.